# the US. Skyline Owners cummunity needs your help and support..



## EL MAMITO USMC (Dec 6, 2007)

i know that Japan is in a crisis, but we also need your help and support also. And i know the economy is not the best but anything from $1,$5,$10 ANYTHING is greatly apreciated..

heres the info:


WE ONLY ASKING TWO THINGS:
1- please donate ANYTHING that you can, from $1.00 to as much as you can and want

2- please copy/paste this post in all the forums that you guys can, we need to spread the word for our just cause and our rigths as US Citizens AND SKYLINE LOVERS...

_heres the info :

US Government Turns Up Heat on Skyline Owners_



_


Vandrel SOUSA founder said:



If you have read the other sticky threads then you are well aware of what is going on. At this point you should be asking yourself one simple question....

Do you want to be among those who stood up against the redundant laws and wasteful spending that is targeting your community, or do you want to be among those who stood back and watched everyone take a stand?

I am a normal person like the rest of you and I understand everyone has their own lives and issues to deal with each day, but this is a chance to make history. Over the past 4 days alone this community has pulled together and worked some magic. The steam has not slowed one bit and it continues to build each day. I have made it clear that it is my sole intent to devote all of my time and resources to fight this and protect everyone.

I do not expect everyone in the community to pitch in and I'm well aware that some of you desire to stay anonymous and out of the spot light, I respect that. I do however, ask that all of you take the time to consider the fact that you may be the next target, you may be the next person to get handed a warrant to seize your car, and when it happens there's nothing you can do to stop it. I have expressed my deepest concerns and passed along my recommendations on preventative measures to safeguard investments, though none of which are a 100% solution but rather deterrents to buy time.

Many of you have already come forth and expressed your desire to help. No help will be turned down, though the best form of help presently is financially. We are in our early stages of preparing for a major battle, one that will decide the fate of everyone's property. Property that is in a state of absolute danger right now. I can promise all of you that my property was just the tip of the iceberg. Those of you who wish to play with fire and remain in a state of denial will find yourselves in a tight spot eventually, up against ICE, and you'll regret not taking part in the organized effort with the rest of us.

Today, I ask that all of you do what is right, stand up for what's right and work together with your fellow community members. I am already in the spot light and on the front lines with ICE, therefore I have no issues being in the headlines of all of this. I will do what I can to take care of the community, unfortunately I too have a life with a family and responsibilities that do come first, but I will commit 110% of what I can. All I ask is for everyone else to do the same.

The Skyline Owners USA PayPal account will be the primary source for the funding of this operation. Donations of all sizes are welcomed and will be put towards legal fees and other related expenses over the course of this ordeal. All expenses and contributions will be documented and accounted for.

If we could manage to have at least 100 or more members step forward and donate $100 each then we could stand a chance to really get into the deep fight on challenging the laws. Financial backing will be everything if anyone expects a real effort on this. I can only do so much by using my own funds and going into this alone.

Our goal for each month is to raise $20,000. I do not fully expect that to happen this early on, but I do hope that everyone makes a effort to reach that goal. 200 members who donate $100 each per month would easily reach our target amount. Already we have received a most generous amount from several members with more planned in the future.

If you are a member here, you own a Skyline, you are in the U.S. and your car does not carry a bond release then you are among the primary ones who are to benefit the most from this operation. Everyone is encouraged to support this operation and I want everyone to keep in mind that not only are your fellow "state legal" members donating, but so are the bond release carrying members. Everyone is pitching in to do their part for the greater good of the community with one goal in mind, to ensure everyone keeps their cars. I, on the other hand, have already lost mine and frankly I don't care.

We made a attempt in 2009, it failed. Let's rewrite our history and show the rest of the world that we will not let the government walk all over us and take what's ours because they say so for no reason other then to collect more money off of us. Let's work together to change the laws that make no sense to anyone other then those who wrote them.

Click to expand...

_*
heres the page to donate for our cause, 

Nissan Skyline Owners U.S.A. - Forum - PayPal Donate*

thank you for your donations

informacion mas reciente:

_


Vandrel said:



The problem with most of the sites that have picked up our story is that people seem to overlook the fact that 90% of the members in our community here had no part in how their cars came into the country. Most of us were simple consumers buying a car in either a private party (person to person) sale or from a misleading business looking to make a quick buck.

Prior to 2008 nearly everyone on here was on their own with no hub like we have today. Everyone was out and about thinking life was great. Once the hub sparked up here and everyone started to talk to one another, only then did everyone start to put 2 and 2 together and realize that there's a lot of shit businesses out there that took most of us for a ride in some fashion. Is it our faults for being the uninformed customers or buyers? That's the real question. That is what will turn the tides for all of us in the end. None of our cars are stolen property, they were just victums to shady business practices which lead all of us to be caught in the middle of a war.

In the end it'll be the people's word vs the government on who's to blame and pay the price. Is the government's case to be that no matter what the owners are the ones who are responsible and thus must pay the price? Or are the people going to stand up and say, hey... don't blame us, blame the businesses and scammers who took us for a ride. The majority of members on here would probably agree to pay "X" amount on taxes to retain ownership and posession of their cars rather then the government force forfiture and removal from the country.

Given that we can have a strong individual stand up and in a passionate mannor communicate our side of the story to the government and rest of the country then we would surely stand a chance to win this.

Click to expand...




Vandrel said:



No problem.

I've noticed on a lot of forums that people often try and make a comparison between stolen property and our cars, that a stolen car that is sold to someone else doesn't infact belong to them and is subject to forfiture. That however, is not the case for our cars and it's common to see people out there who are very misinformed make comparisons that are apples and oranges. 

What I also find that people like to compare is drugs and our cars, saying that if you buy an illegal substance from someone that it's still illegal and you will A) lose it B) be in trouble. Again, apples and oranges. We're talking about cars, not illegal mind altering substances that are common knowledge to be illegal. Furthermore, the technical classification for our cars wouldn't be "ILLEGAL", it would be "NON-CONFORMING" which ICE commonly classifies as "CONTRABAND" in that they were smuggled in the country. Being that right now I can tell you it's a fact that ICE will not be able to source the exact method that everyone's cars entered the country because there is no database that accounts for auto parts being imported. So for those of us who may have cars that entered as parts, there's no way for ICE to technically say your car was smuggled in without generalizing with fictional information to go off of.

There is also the little clause that covers reassembling parts that are imported. Stating that it's ok to import auto parts (ie: a body) and it's not regulated, however if you reassemble it using the original parts (ie: strip it and put it back together) then that would be circumventing and a violation. But again, who's to say that the parts are original and who's fault is it that the car was reassembled? Again, is it the owners to blame? Most of us simply bought a car that carried a valid state title. Some of our cars have been registered and reregistered in states for over 8 years or more.

Click to expand...

_









:Cry:


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## archaeic_bloke (Apr 22, 2008)

I'm inquiring my own sources to see whats up.. will post response when available.. very interesting...


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## Eaze (Jun 19, 2009)

Yeah, it really smacks us in the face to see this crap. This is one the very reasons I stay in Europe to begin with.


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## EL MAMITO USMC (Dec 6, 2007)

archaeic_bloke said:


> I'm inquiring my own sources to see whats up.. will post response when available.. very interesting...


ok, any questions feel free to contact me or our CEO Vandrel @

[email protected]


thanks and please pass this info to all your skyline friends .. maybe some can help.. thanks again


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## Mook (Mar 20, 2007)

two points

firstly exactly WHO does the money go to? Some Over priced lawyer

and two, i think if anyone has any spare cash, there are better casues to donate to

imho

mook


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

I have to agree Mook. Whilst no-one wants to see some civil servants becoming automotive thought police it pales into insignificance when one sees the devastation that has occured in the land where these very cars come from. Whilst I feel the whole situation is unfair in the USA I don't think now is the time to worry about that as a top priority. Sorry


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## EL MAMITO USMC (Dec 6, 2007)

Mook said:


> two points
> 
> firstly exactly WHO does the money go to? Some Over priced lawyer
> 
> ...


1- the money is for the fund for our legal defense, we in preparations for a upcoming battle with the US gov for the rightful possession and ownership of our cars. so, *NO*, the money is not going to an overpriced lawyer. The actual lawyer that we have has given us a "extremely great rate" for the fact that he has seen how the government has spend thousand of dollars(in a very bad economy) in just looking and seizing some cars, that doesn't affect anybody or anything. 
2-yes, there are other causes that it could be donated too, but thats why I'm asking in car forums for donations, because YOU are people like "US" , car enthusiastic that love their skylines or their recreational car(which ever the case may be) and will do anything (legally of course) to protect their property from people that should definitely be doing more important things with their time and tax payers money. we are not asking for thousands of dollars, just any extra pocket change, that you guys might have. the most arduous part of donating is taking Min's to log in in to your paypal acct and donate any amount desired. 





Juggles said:


> Whilst I feel the whole situation is unfair in the USA I don't think now is the time to worry about that as a top priority. Sorry


 you are correct that this is not the best time, but unfortunately this is the time that the battle is going to go down. one of the most influential persons in the hole US skyline community had his cars seized, and you know why? because some one made a big lie and made up a huge story about him and once the agents got to his house and saw the "waste" of time they even had to call their higher bosses to ask permission to take his property because they knew that it was a waste of time but they were there so they had to do it.. 

so know since they cant do some thing more important like control the illegal immigration of millions of illegal aliens they are going after a few car owners so they can show that they are doing something(which 99.99% of Americans don't give a krap)
so please if you cant donate at this time, please pass this info in an email or other forums, so the car community car see our state of emergency and maybe some can donate..


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

Its a bunch of illegally imported cars, not something to support. 

Give your money to Japan to support the victims of the earthquake.


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## EL MAMITO USMC (Dec 6, 2007)

tyndago said:


> Its a bunch of illegally imported cars, not something to support.
> 
> Give your money to Japan to support the victims of the earthquake.


Mr. Morris , what ever controversy or problems that you might have with other people please direct it to them and I'm respectfully asking you, that if your not going to post any assistance or positive info in a tread that i have started , please restrain your self and do not post. 

VR

EM USMC


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

EL MAMITO USMC said:


> se direct it to them and I'm respectfully asking you, that if your not going to post any assistance or positive info in a tread that i have started , please restrain your self and do not post.


Do not post solicitation for illegally imported cars, and asking for people to support illegal activities.

There is a proper path for vehicle importation in the US, and these people chose to simply ignore the rules for import. 

Why should anyone give money away for that, when they can support someone that really needs it, like Japan?


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## RSVFOUR (May 1, 2006)

Personally I think that posting a request for help with this is taking the proverbial and thats without the japanese disaster. 
With it its actually bad taste IMHO .
Sorry buts thats the way I see it.


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

Here's a picture of someone elses car that they would prefer not to have lost (it's a gunmetal R32 by the way):










Although I suspect the owner of this car probably has more pressing things to worry about than even his Nissan Skyline


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## SkylineUSA (Jun 29, 2001)

I know the best of intentions were intended asking for donations, but I do not think right now is this best time to bring this subject up, since our plight pales in comparison to the events that have unfolded in Japan, but I must say this.

BUT I must say this Sean Morris is a hypocrite!!!!!!
He has given money to our community to become an elite member on our site, which tells me he does support what we are doing, and has made many posts that totally contradict his statement above, such as:

Originally Posted by Tyndago View Post
"SkylineUSA Sean said about 11-12 years ago that he would go after anyone that bypassed gov't channels to import GTRs. That is when he was working for MotoRex."

"Tyndago: I am pretty sure he mentioned something about this a few years ago that did change that mindset on freshalloy, but I cannot find it.

When I was in the business of importing cars though Motorex, and it was my job, cars imported other ways were not high on my list of good things. If you worked for Gucci, I am pretty sure you wouldn't be supporting knock offs.

Its about 9 years since then. About 6 years since Motorex closed."

"Quote:
Hey Sean! How come whenever there is anything going on with our cars that is a little less than legit you pipe up?
With the last couple days and the things that have, or have not happened you are here in full force!?
The things that have happened to a certain member are by no means public info now are they?
If you are infact here to help matters then lets put our heads together and unite forces and fight for the common goal here!
Otherwise.........."
I don't see this on here anymore, but I had it in my email.

"Tyndago:I "pipe up" because people contact me. I get emails. I get phone calls. There is a lot more that goes on, in the real world, in phone calls, and meetings. I have given a lot of people advice, and after saying the same things over and over, I can only have so much patience.

I gave Daryl at Kaizo a lot of advice, years ago. If he had followed my advice, he probably would have not ended up in the situation he was in. I have provided the attorneys with a lot of information, and advice on how to fight this from the Kaizo view. What parts to go after.

You have no idea who or what I have already helped, or tried to help. What advice I have given to people, both on and off the forums. If the "kids" don't want to listen - then fu*k them, have fun getting your shit seized."

And this one, there are more of course.


I have been doing my best to keep people up to date on the Kaizo drama, what is happening, and some of the ways that there are inconsistencies.

Quote:
This will be a summary of posts so far to bring people up to speed on the Kaizo drama. No charges have been filed by the DOJ(Department of Justice) against Kaizo or the owners of Kaizo. The DOJ and ICE(Immigration and Customs Enforcement) have been sending letters out to owners, and seizing vehicles – Guilty before proven innocent – thank you for due process. We appreciate it, big bad, Kevlar clad, gun toting agents, going after car owners with as dangerous things as a speeding ticket on their record. We appreciate the use of your budget in these times of 17% unemployment in California, and the inability of the California legislature to even keep the Department of Motor Vehicles open on Fridays.

We appreciate it, thanks for running everything so well. Thanks for going after the drugs, the terrorists, and dangerous illegal aliens. These 50 or so Kaizo cars, most around the $75,000 range, are a danger to everyone everywhere.

Some of the Kaizo owners have got together and retained the services of a customs attorney. There is strength in numbers, and anyone else that wants to be involved, help out, or has something to contribute, email me. [email protected]
A poster from an RX-7 forum posted up some information that he later asked me to take some specific references down. I altered what I had first posted, and he took his posts down from the forum. People getting a bit too “talky”.

... ICE said that pretty much the skylines from kaizo are contra band. They are taking a snippet of the law from one part, and another snippet of law from another part. (regarding chassis and smog/manufacturer liabilities). He did say they are not far off from doing it completely legit though... He asked if i knew anyone with a kaizo car, (dont worry i didnt rat you out :] ) but he said, that as long as you get your cali-smog expempt at the begining of each year, you are fine and there is nothing they can do against you. He also said tht AZ and FL are the only states that dont give a crap about such things and thats why they are so popular to have cars registered there.



July 2nd 2009

The initial government investigation against Kaizo was to check out charges of smuggling and violations of the Clean Air Act. The government always goes after the Clean Air Act. Everything is still in a holding pattern until any actual charges are filed. I also found out besides the "buggy" car that was not impounded(it had a VW engine in it), the black R34 had no driveline in it.

EPA Information

This section under "kit car policy".

The production, sale and importation of automotive bodies alone (i.e., no chassis, engine or transmission) are not regulated by EPA since such units are not considered "motor vehicles" under the Clean Air Act. EPA form 3520-1 is not required for imported automotive bodies. A motor vehicle from which the engine has been removed is still a motor vehicle and is not considered a body.

These regulations were written when most cars were body on frame, not “unibody” as most new cars are constructed. That is why they refer to the body, and the chassis as two separate parts.

DOT requirements.

A disassembled vehicle that is shipped without an engine and transmission is treated for importation purposes not as a motor vehicle, but instead as an assemblage of motor vehicle equipment items. Such an assemblage can lawfully be imported into the U.S., provided any equipment included in the assemblage that is subject to FMVSS, but was not originally manufactured to comply with that FMVSS or was not so certified by its original manufacturer, is removed from the assemblage prior to entry into the U.S. Equipment items that are subject to the FMVSS include tires, rims, brake hoses, brake fluid, seat belt assemblies, glazing materials, and lamps, reflective devices, and associated equipment.



July 22, 2009

I spoke to a person today that informed me that they had a call from ICE on their vehicle. The ICE agent asked to come out and take photos of the vehicle. The person that received the call asked if the car was going to be seized, and the ICE agent said that it was not going to be seized. I advised him that he should speak to a lawyer before he allows anyone to come and investigate any of his property.

What I think that ICE wants to see is the body and the engine together. They are still investigating Kaizo, and looking to see if they supplied engines and bodies together.

All "public interest" legislation (and any distribution of money taken by force from some men for the unearned benefit of others) comes down ultimately to the grant of an undefined undefinable, non-objective, arbitrary power to some government officials. The worst aspect of it is not that such a power can be used dishonestly, but that it cannot be used honestly. The wisest man in the world, with the purest integrity, cannot find a criterion for the just, equitable, rational application of an unjust, inequitable, irrational principle.

-Ayn Rand

The law was made for one thing alone, for the exploitation of those who don't understand it, or are prevented by naked misery from obeying it.
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tyndago
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August 2, 2009

Some of Kaizos customers have been contacted by ICE, and agents have come out and photographed cars, and asked questions. Here is an excerpt of one of the agents visits to a Kaizo car.

How did you first hear about Kaizo? Do you have the "blue plate" (the one that the cars from Japan have with the VIN)? Did Daryl Alison discuss the legality of the "installation" (i said, "what installation". he said, "nevermind")? Did the car come with an engine? What is the primary use of this vehicle? Were you able to title it for road use? Were was the car previously titled? Did Daryl Alison provide to you a Japanese owners manual? Did Daryl Alison provide documents on the importation of the vehicle? Did Daryl Alison provide any original Japanese paperwork? He then proceeded to take detailed photos. Items of interest were head and tail light assemblies, side view mirrors, Kaizo serial numbers on firewall and door jam, speedo, odometer, and 3rd brake light. He was interested in the writing scribed on the lenses of all the exterior lights, and in obtaining a photo of the engine serial #.... which he was not able to do,

August 16, 2009

One Kaizo customer recently received a letter from the US Department of Justice about his vehicle. The letter is a little vague as it says “if my information is correct…” , this sounds like they are second guessing themselves. They then say that non-compliant vehicles are subject to seizure and forfeiture.

Then the letter states that the vehicle must be exported within 60 days of receipt of the letter. Based on the information we have, this vehicle was imported as parts, and reassembled by the owner here in the US. The US allows for vehicles to be imported into the US as parts, and there fore was not “illegally” imported as the US Department of Justice is implying.




September 3, 2009

Over at Supraforums someone posted this picture of two of Kaizos cars sitting at an impound yard near San Diego. The poster was told "they were going to crush them".

Charges have still not be brought against Kaizo, and in an interesting turn of events, these cars were not actually owned by Kaizo when they were seized. They were scheduled to be exported from the US . We are not going to disclose who the owner of these cars are, but it will probably come out in due time.

SKY1
The blue R34 is the "hero" car from Fast and Furious 4, and the red car is a GTS with GTR fenders and an RB26. Its now after Labor Day, and still no charges in the Kaizo case. The government seems to be expending a lot of time and resources on these 50 or so cars and owners here in the US.



September 14, 2009

I had a call recently from someone that said the FBI was also in on this investigation. They had asked some information about some transactions. So now its FBI , ICE, DOT, EPA, CARB all on the chase of about 50 cars that were sold over the last three years. In that same amount of time, about 30,000,000 cars were sold new in the US. Way to use resources to chase after the dangerous car peddlers. The same guys that pay the taxes, and registration fees on the cars they put together here in the US.


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## SkylineUSA (Jun 29, 2001)

Supraforums has an ongoing discussion on Kaizo here .

My latest post :
Quote:
Originally Posted by mignuts View Post
Actually, from what they said, Kaizo was recognized in over 30 states as a manufacturer. The problem is that they never were an RI or ICI, so for them to even be bringing in these cars/parts was a bit questionable. Not even sure how Silvia's were starting to show up as well.

If you are a manufacturer, then you should not be an RI or an ICI. They are different things completely. They follow different rules and regulations on importing.

So if Kaizo was "recognized as a manufacturer" by a state, and states are the ones that deal with titling a car, then were they in the right ?

Importing auto parts is legal. Titling cars is legal. So is this not a state issue, not a federal issue now ? Up to the individual states, like marijuana laws in California ? Although Federally its not allowed, on a state level it is allowed with certain restrictions.

If Kaizo only sold rolling bodies less engine and transmission like say Rossion or Superperformance, then where are the differences ?

Superformance | F.A.Q.'s

" How complete is a Superformance roller?

Imagine a complete car ***8211; take out the engine and transmission (transaxle) and that is our replica. They are completely assembled and painted at our factory by experts that have produced over 2500 MKIII***8217;s plus our other product lines. "

"How do I register my Superformance chassis?

Each state in the USA has different requirements and regulations with regards to the registration of your specially constructed vehicle. We highly recommend that you verify all requirements with your local DMV office.

SEMA has posted a list of state by state registration information : visit this link. SEMA SAN."

September 26,2009

R34-IT- Nov-2009

While checking out my friend Carters Jung's book - Import Tuner , in the letters section was a letter and a few pictures of the Fast and Furious Kaizo R34 on a tow truck. They mentioned that they first thought it was the ***8220;stolen***8221; GTS from North Hollywood from a while back. This is not that stolen car.

This is one of the cars that was seized at Kaizo. They mention in the article that the car was at Manheim Auto Auction in Oceanside. Since then a poster on Supraforums mentioned that they had seen the Kaizo cars being moved on a transporter. I wonder where they were being moved to ?

Still no charges, or other information in the Kaizo case yet.

Source : Import Tuner



September 30,2009

UPDATE . Two R34's and an R32 were seized today. My information says that they are not done seizing cars. If you have a car, I would be on the look out.

I was just informed that a Kaizo R34, an individual owners vehicle was seized this morning by ICE agents. The agents in full Kevlar served a seizure warrant to an owner in the LA area. I know the owner and the car. Again, they came to the owners residence, and seized the car from there. Details are sketchy right now, but as far as we know this is the first "owner" vehicle seized. Still no charges against Kaizo, but it seems like the government is seizing cars. The car in California was an SB100 car, so this could be one of the focuses.

SB100 is a specialty constructed vehicle exemption in California. It allows for up to 500 cars per year to be registered with no smog checks if the car is accepted as a 1960 or does not resemble any other vehicle.

Per California Vehicle Code §4750.1, the first 500 program applicants in each calendar year may choose whether the inspection is based on the model-year of the engine used in the vehicle or the vehicle model-year. If the engine or the vehicle does not sufficiently resemble one previously manufactured, the referee will assign 1960 as the model-year.

Its a good program for specialty vehicles. Cars that are driven very little, and mostly just used to go to shows.

580. A "specially constructed vehicle" is a vehicle which is built for private use, not for resale, and is not constructed by a licensed manufacturer or remanufacturer. A specially constructed vehicle may be built from (1) a kit; (2) new or used, or a combination of new and used, parts; or (3) a vehicle reported for dismantling, as required by Section 5500 or 11520, which, when reconstructed, does not resemble the original make of the vehicle dismantled. A specially constructed vehicle is not a vehicle which has been repaired or restored to its original design by replacing parts.

#1 SPCV can be a kit

#2 SPCV can be new or used parts (aka does not need to be a "kit")

#3 SPCV can be a vehicle reported for dismantling that does not resemble original car.

A SPCV can be any one of these three things. It does not need to meet all 3 requirements.

The last line is ambiguous and open to legal interpretation.



So does everyone that is reading this post feel safer now ? Do they feel better that a couple of vehicles have been taken off the road ? Are you going to help out, or stand on the sidelines and watch ? Are you going to get involved ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by El Mamito USMC View Post
as Sean said, he didnt "rat us over" or anything like that. i havent spoke with him personally just by referense but so far hes 110% legit and in pro of the OWNERS not the sellers. since he knows many of US have been **** by the guys who sold us "cars"
Did we not meet at the Super Autobacs meet a few years ago? I think I remember your car there.

As far as PRO owner. I have done my best over the years to inform people, let them know if they were buying something, the issues they might have. I am not going to tell someone how to break the law, that can get me in trouble. I will however tell them the laws, and then let them figure it out. If they want to do it the full EPA and DOT and ARB way, I can help them with that too. There is not another person in the US with all the experience I have on this subject matter when it comes to the Nissan Skylines. There are registered importers with more experience, but I have probably visited, or talked with nearly all of them.

Lets talk a few scammers I have tried to out over the years.

Jeremy Boddy - Drift Tuners, or whatever name he is using this week.
http://vehicleimport.blogspot.com/se...Drift Tuners

Supaca Imports - Vehicle Import

I went as far as going to "Supaca's Office" to check them out.

They are just examples of guys that take peoples hard earned money, and deliver nothing.

There are plenty of places that have, and continue to import complete cars, and disassembled cars to the US. Though Florida, though Canada. I will bet I have nearly spoken to all of them on the phone at one time or another. I might have even been to their shops, or given them technical assistance when I was at RB. I might have even sold them parts to help support the cars.

I am 100% Pro owner. I am 100% anti scammer. I consider someone to be a scammer if they are not upfront with someone they are selling a car. I consider Next Level to be a scammer, because they are offering EPA and DOT legal cars, that they can not do. If they just offered the cars, with no lies about DOT and EPA, I would not have an issue with them. However, all that changes when they prey on peoples lack of understanding of the importation rules. I see it every month. I still get emails every month. I still help probably 2-3 people a month to ask the right questions, and to be informed of what they are purchasing.

If you want to be the guy, that calls the cops when your 25 pounds of marijuana gets stolen, you be that guy.

Quote:
ebruary 11, 2011 | 7:15 am

For this crime victim, calling the police was definitely a brave move.

Newport Beach police are investigating a man who claims the 25 pounds of marijuana stolen from his home over the weekend were legally grown. Authorities would not identify the man because, at this point, he's considered the victim of a residential burglary.

At about 4:40 p.m. Sunday, a resident in the 20000 block of Spruce Avenue in Santa Ana Heights called police saying he was witnessing two men breaking into a neighbor's home. The men used a hammer to break the glass on the front door and get inside, said Sgt. Steve Burdette.

The homeowner said boxes packed with marijuana worth about $50,000 were taken, Burdette said. The homeowner told police he has a permit that allows him to grow marijuana. Newport Beach does not have any kind of license or permit that allows people to grow marijuana, said City Atty. David Hunt.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lano...vestigate.html

____________________________________________________

I am just saying, once someone shows that they are a hypocrite, they cannot be trusted. It's plan to see he has some sort of agenda, and our community wants nothing to do with him, or his BS jumping back an forth over the fence, playing sides on whoever will listen to ego drive rhetoric or pay him some cash.


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

SkylineUSA said:


> Are you going to help out, or stand on the sidelines and watch ? Are you going to get involved ?


I will help out where I can and where it would be of benefit but my attentions are, for the time being at least, focussed on many friends affected directly and indirectly by recent events in Japan. We have set up a fundraising page which you donate through or order merchandise and can post on your forums and send to your members as well: HOPE: help us raise funds for people in Japan
Are you going to help out, or stand on the sidelines and watch ? Are you going to get involved ?



.


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## SkylineUSA (Jun 29, 2001)

Fuggles,

For the record, I did not post that. That was in a post by someone else


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

Still the same guy when it comes to illegally imported cars. I have tolerated them over the years, but I don't like them. Still trying to help and inform the Skyline owners. However, if they don't want to know the truth, or think I am lying about things, all they need to do, is look at the information I have posted on forums, and my blogs the last 12 years. 

There is a right way, and a way these guys are doing it. Ignorance of the law is not an excuse. If they have a serious issue with what they bought, go back and take issue with the person they bought the car from. If they had done their due diligence then, they would not be in this mess. Instead, ignorant consumers have driven this market, with the shady importers taking the money.

For 12 years I have been putting out information on this subject. The only thing that most people do, is complain about the price, and say they "ain't got emissions testing in my state." When you are in my position, and trying to do everything importation related correctly, to minimize these hassles, how would you feel, when the guys doing it wrong get popped. I have tolerated the state titled cars for years. I think I have talked to most of the guys that have done import, and titling in the US. Everything from bringing in complete cars, to driving them down from Canada.Another Seized Car : R32 GT-R : Canadian Border | Vehicle Import

If you want a race car, you import a car as a legal race car, the way we did. How to Import a Race Car Permanently to the USA | Vehicle Import. 










Do it wrong, and your R34 gets towed on a wheel lift. 

From 2008, and a post on NICO. Seized R34 GT-R's and S15 | Vehicle Import









These mainstream seizures have been happening since 2008. R32 GT-R Seized in Texas | Vehicle Import

There are others, but they aren't as public as the ones from forum posters.


















EPA Settlement Agreement on 17 Illegally Imported Vehicles. | Vehicle Import



> THIS SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT is made and entered into by and between the United States Environmental Protection Agency EPA and David Nelson of Tacoma, Washington Respondent.
> 
> 4. 40 C.F.R. § 85.15 13 prohibits the importation of a motor vehicle which in not covered by a certificate of conformity.
> 
> ...


There are many more. For every one guy that gets caught, there are 10 others that do not. I have finally grown tired of the ignorance. As I said, I tolerated it over the years, I no longer do.


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

SkylineUSA said:


> I am just saying, once someone shows that they are a hypocrite, they cannot be trusted. It's plan to see he has some sort of agenda, and our community wants nothing to do with him, or his BS jumping back an forth over the fence, playing sides on whoever will listen to ego drive rhetoric or pay him some cash.


I've given you guys enough rope, now go hang yourselves with it. 

So anyone answer why the almighty and smart Steve- Vandrel, after he was investigated by ICE, and DMV, went and took his complete car apart? Took what was a pretty simple import violation, and turn it into a possible criminal act by tampering with the car they had seen? It was pretty simple, if the car was not there when they came back, they could not have seized it. Say he were out driving it, or loaned it to a friend. 

However his actions, show the overall consensus on those forums. A bunch of kids, that think they know better than the law, and can "get one over" on the law. 

Why did Steve tell no one to worry, when in fact they had everything to worry about?

I take it seriously, this import and legalization thing, however none of your "boys" do until they get their cars seized, at which point it is too late. I have seen too many of the Kaizo cars get seized. Heard too much crying from owners having their cars seized. Heard too much crying from people getting scammed by importers. Heard too much crying. 

Its time to try and put a stop to it, if that means the guys that have illegal cars now, lose their cars, that is how it is going to be. Do it right, or don't do it. If they have an issue, they are going to have to take that up with ICE. They are going to have to take that up with the guys that illegally imported the cars.

Just because you "WANT" something, does not mean you have a RIGHT to have it.


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

SkylineUSA said:


> Fuggles,
> 
> For the record, I did not post that. That was in a post by someone else


Apologies. Thanks for correcting


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## SkylineUSA (Jun 29, 2001)

tyndago said:


> I've given you guys enough rope, now go hang yourselves with it.


Son, you have no credibility, so move along.

You have flip flopped so many times, anything you post is tainted.


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## Mookistar (Feb 5, 2004)

opcorn:opcorn:opcorn:opcorn:


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

SkylineUSA said:


> Son, you have no credibility, so move along.
> 
> You have flip flopped so many times, anything you post is tainted.


Everything I post is the truth. Links, information. Backed up with stories, pictures. 

All you are doing is crying that you are the victims, when you are nothing of the sort. You are trying to bypass the set in place rules and regulations

You post no responses to any of the actual questions. You say I have no credibility, I have all the credibility. 

Where are all the DOT and EPA approved Nissan Skylines you have imported?

You have to pay to play, but you all do not think the importation rules and regulations apply to yourselves. 

I said I tolerated the cars, I gave you information on how to keep their cars, and they don't follow it, so I give up on it. I only have tolerance for so many idiots. 

The truth hurts, and these kids are typical American's, they want to be catered to, and push the blame off on anyone other than themselves. Be big kids, step up, take responsibility. If you did nothing wrong, you have nothing to worry about.


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

This is the Reason the Nissan Skyline is Illegal in the US



> Its heard all the time on the internet, the Nissan Skyline is illegal in the USA. To the layperson, they may hear this and take it as gospel. It used to be you would hear its illegal because it is right hand drive. You would hear that it is illegal because it was too fast. Neither of which is true. Here is the true reason that the Nissan Skyline is illegal in the US, Mercedes Benz North America.





> The grey market was successful enough that it ate significantly into the business of Mercedes-Benz of North America and their dealers. The corporation launched a successful million-dollar congressional lobbying effort to stop private importation of vehicles not officially intended for the U.S. market.


Its money. I try and tell people its money, but I have to go and break everything down into simple chunks for the idiots. I could spend a year, holding your guys hands, but you don't listen, so whats the point?

Now you try and mess with my credibility, I make it personal.


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## SkylineUSA (Jun 29, 2001)

No, it is the fact that you are plainly playing on both sides, that has completely ruined your credibility, not the gov't red tape crap that you have posted. You have not posted one thing has been an epiphany, that us idiots at SOUSA did not already know. 

You son, may have thought that noose was for our community, but it turned out to be for you.


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## Eaze (Jun 19, 2009)

Well I was hopeing by the end of next year I would be going to college in Arizona driving my R32 but instead I may just have to stay in Europe until things are solved or I get kicked out of here.


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

SkylineUSA said:


> No, it is the fact that you are plainly playing on both sides, that has completely ruined your credibility, not the gov't red tape crap that you have posted. You have not posted one thing has been an epiphany, that us idiots at SOUSA did not already know. .


Playing both sides? You have not the clue. Reading comprehension is not your strong point is it? How about answering questions that are posed, and not simple responses trying to provoke, for just provoking? 

Like I said, rocket scientists. The question that has been posed by me over and over, and still has not had an answer is why did Steve take his car apart? Where was his lawyers advice then. If he and you guys "knew" what you were doing, he would still have his car.

Since he has neither, its all big talk, and no substance. Talk, talk, talk. Back it up kid. You ain't got nothing on me. 

Lets see how this all works out for you in a couple of years. I have done it,and I know. You all will fail, and I will be sitting off to the side laughing at you. 25 years will come, then it won't even matter on the early cars. Each year, it won't matter. However, its a long time off, for a 1999 R34. In case you failed math, which I am sure you did, its about 13 years. 2024 again, I will write it out for you because you seem to be unable to deduce things yourself.

As an entire community, you have less skills, less talent,and less connections than I do. I put out the challenge, you talk big now, its going to give me great ammunition to poke you with, in a couple years. I will make sure I bookmark this page, and see how you are doing with the law changing.

See how you are going with crying how you are disabled combat vet victims of circumstances.


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

you know what? The more I read this the more I want to do for GTROC members, friends and family in Japan. Moderators close this thread. It's all about some people who care only about their own plight rather than all the far more importnat things happening in the world right now


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## mattysupra (Oct 31, 2008)

Just to clear this up for me and i have only skipt over the thread. 

All these illegal cars are registered as race cars hence you can only use on the race track? 

So if your not using the cars on the road and have the papework that tynedago has posted your o.k? 

If this is the case then why are they being seized? Or have you all got them in the country doing this and then some how got them road legal or in this case not legal - 

How have people managed to insure and MOT (not sure what you call it but the mot in the U.k is a test for safety and to see if roadworthy) Also how have you registered the car to be able to use it on the road? In the u.k we have to register the car and then it gets given a registration number. 

If you have not done all the above then the cars will get seized just like they would in the u.k if we drove it and it did not have the above would they not?


And finally, why cant you sell your 'illegal' cars to the U.K etc if there not allowed over there before they get seized?


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## mattysupra (Oct 31, 2008)

Fuggles said:


> you know what? The more I read this the more I want to do for GTROC members, friends and family in Japan. Moderators close this thread. It's all about some people who care only about their own plight rather than all the far more importnat things happening in the world right now




Can we Keep it open untill my questions get answered please! Im trying to work out how they have got themselves in this mess! 

However, i will be sending my spare money to Japan. Defo the wrong time to ask for money to keep a lump of metal.


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

Seems like a plan.


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## SkylineUSA (Jun 29, 2001)

"Originally Posted by tyndago 
How many people are actually willing to help $$$$$$$?

I have thought about this a lot, a lot longer than anyone else. I know the in's and outs, and things can be done, but it is slow. It is costly.

People don't want to pony up the cash. After all, look at all the places that have gone and copy what Motorex did in regards to import and legalization...all those guys... I mean no one."


Sounds like since we did not want to pay your extorstion fees, since you're the only one with the knowledge to fix this issue, you said F#*K you guys. I am going to call ICE on you, and you will all fail. That is how I read it. There are other posts.


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## SkylineUSA (Jun 29, 2001)

mattysupra said:


> All these illegal cars are registered as race cars hence you can only use on the race track?
> 
> So if your not using the cars on the road and have the papework that tynedago has posted your o.k?
> 
> ...


It is not the same as in the UK, of course that really goes without saying. There are some gray areas in the whole issue.

I am sure Sean will put his twist on the subject, since he loves to prove his point.

*Sean, did all to MotoRex Skylines have OBDs installed?*:thumbsup:


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## SkylineUSA (Jun 29, 2001)

As long as the drive-line is out of a car, its not considered a car, and EPA, DOT regulations do not apply. And can legally be imported as automotive parts. Some guys where doing this, but putting the original drive-lines back in them, then registering them in a state. That part is the not legal part of the whole issue, since it circumvents a lot of gov't regulations.


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

Sorry to ask but I can't be bothered to read it all. What's the money for? I pay for all my own repairs, servicing, insurance, tax and pretty much everything to keep my car on the road. So why is this any different? If you really want to keep it, remortgage, sell something else and keep the car. When you've all done that and run out of funds then maybe ask for someone to give you money to keep your car on the road. Or is that being a bit harsh?


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## Mook (Mar 20, 2007)

John, forget the money. They won't get a penny off here but the legal situation is very interesting

Mook


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

SkylineUSA said:


> It is not the same as in the UK, of course that really goes without saying. There are some gray areas in the whole issue.


You, my man, are an importing genius. Not only that, you string together sentences with the intelligence of a third grade special education student. Bravo.

There is no gray area. 

A race car is a race car. It must be proved to be such in front of the DOT and EPA. It MUST be used in a race series, it must have race history. You can not simply declare a vehicle to be a race car. 

How to Import a Race Car Permanently to the USA | Vehicle Import

To import a racing vehicle into the United States on a permanent basis, you must:

*Obtain from the vehicles original manufacturer a letter stating that the vehicle was originally manufactured as a racing vehicle.*

File with Customs, upon entry, an HS-7 Declaration form on which Box 8 is checked, indicating that the vehicle was not manufactured primarily for use on the public roads, and is therefore not a motor vehicle subject to the Federal Motor Vehicle Safety, Bumper, and Theft Protection Standards.
Attach a copy of the manufacturer***8217;s letter to the HS-7 Declaration form that you furnish to Customs.
To import a motor vehicle into the United States on a temporary basis for racing purposes, you must:
Apply to NHTSA for a letter granting you permission to import the vehicle on a temporary basis. For that purpose, you should use the application form posted on this website.
File with Customs, upon entry, an HS-7 Declaration form on which Box 7 is checked, indicating that the motor vehicle does not comply with all applicable Federal Motor Vehicle Safety, Bumper, and Theft Prevention Standards, but is being imported solely for the purpose of competitive racing events.
Attach a copy of the NHTSA permission letter to the HS-7 Declaration form that you furnish to Customs.
To obtain such a permission letter from NHTSA, you must submit to the agency the following information in the order stated:
Importer***8217;s name, address, and daytime phone number.
Customs broker***8217;s name, contact, and phone number.
Vehicle information (make, model, model year, and VIN or identifying number).
A list of the racing features of the vehicle.
A list of the features lacking that are needed for use of the vehicle on public roads.
Photographs showing the following views: front, rear, side, and interior. Racing features and/or features lacking for on-road use on public roads should be shown in the photographs.
The name of the sanctioning body and competition class.
Previous race history of the vehicle (if any).
Schedule of racing events, including dates and locations where vehicle will compete (if any).
Copy of the competition-racing license of the importer (if any).
Permission to import a motor vehicle temporarily is granted in annual increments for up to three years if duty is not paid, or for up to five years if duty is paid. No later than 30 days after the expiration of the period for which permission is granted, the vehicle must be either exported from the United States or destroyed. 


RESTRICTION FOR REGISTRATION AND LICENSING
A racing vehicle may not be registered or licensed for on-road use. A vehicle allowed entry for racing purposes cannot subsequently be converted for use on public roads.



SkylineUSA said:


> *Sean, did all to MotoRex Skylines have OBDs installed?*:thumbsup:


What exactly is an OBD's? Can you please send me a link, because I can't figure out what exactly you are referring to.

Do you mean, did the cars have an on board diagnostic system? Well yes sir, every single one of them has an on board diagnostic system. 

Match wits with me idiot. You have not the clue what you are talking about.


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

SkylineUSA said:


> As long as the drive-line is out of a car, its not considered a car, and EPA, DOT regulations do not apply. And can legally be imported as automotive parts. Some guys where doing this, but putting the original drive-lines back in them, then registering them in a state. That part is the not legal part of the whole issue, since it circumvents a lot of gov't regulations.



However, disassembling a car, specifically for the purposes of importing it is illegal. 

In the US, it is a violation of the Clean Air Act.

EPA Settlement Agreement on 17 Illegally Imported Vehicles. | Vehicle Import
4. 40 C.F.R. § 85.15 13 prohibits the importation of a motor vehicle which in not covered by a certificate of conformity.



5. Section 216a2 of the Act defines motor vehicle as any self-propelled vehicle designed for transporting persons or property on a street or highway. EPA has further explained that a disassembled vehicle or an approximate disassembled vehicle constitutes a motor vehicle. EPA Kit Car Policy July 8, 1994.



6. Certificate of Conformity: A "Certificate of Conformity" means the document issued by EPA to a manufacturer under 40 C.F.R. Part 86 after EPA has determined that the manufacturer's application is complete and that the engine family meets the requirements ofthe applicable regulations and the Act. Issuance ofthe Certificate of Conformity permits production of motor vehicles built in accordance with the manufacturer's application provided that the production is within the Model Year for which the Certificate of Conformity is issued.



7. Section 203a1 of the Act, 42 U.S.C. § 7522a1 prohibits the importation into the United States of any new motor vehicle manufactured after the effective date of the regulations unless the motor vehicle is covered by an EPA certificate of conformity .

Boys should not match wits with men. So Mr. Skyline USA. Why did the lead idiot Steve, disassemble a complete car, that ICE and DMV agents had come and seen?

Anyone else think, that maybe, you should consult with a lawyer, if federal agents come knocking? You think maybe, you should consider the ramifications of disassembling a car, that was obviously complete and driven on the road, the last time the agents visitied. We are not dealing with rocket scientists. We are dealing with people that think the laws do not apply to them. We are dealing with people that want to "get one over" on the people that do it legally. 










The agents already saw the car complete, they come back a week later, and its a shell? 

To report suspicious activity, call ICE toll-free at 1-866-DHS-2ICE.


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## SkylineUSA (Jun 29, 2001)

I could have sworn that was one of the issues with them closing down MotoRex, no OBDs installed. 

Son, I see your reading comprehension is lacking, I never mention race vehicles. 

And yes, there is a gray area. If that was not the case, why are there so many skylines in the States? Gray area....WINNING!!!!!!

And you only completed the crash test data for the R33, but you still illegal impoted R32 and R34s, right?


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## SkylineUSA (Jun 29, 2001)

There are other factors involved, that is all I am going to say.


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## SkylineUSA (Jun 29, 2001)

They had OBDIIs?


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

mattysupra said:


> All these illegal cars are registered as race cars hence you can only use on the race track?


Getting a car in as a legal race car is difficult. These cars are not imported as such. I helped to import both permanent and temporary race cars. 



mattysupra said:


> So if your not using the cars on the road and have the papework that tynedago has posted your o.k?


They don't have it. 



mattysupra said:


> If this is the case then why are they being seized? Or have you all got them in the country doing this and then some how got them road legal or in this case not legal -


They bypassed the Federal importing laws. They take the cars apart, and import them as parts, bypassing both customs laws and taxes. 



mattysupra said:


> How have people managed to insure and MOT (not sure what you call it but the mot in the U.k is a test for safety and to see if roadworthy) Also how have you registered the car to be able to use it on the road? In the u.k we have to register the car and then it gets given a registration number.


The federal government handles the import side of it for vehicles. However when they are imported as parts, the are not declared to the government. Some are seized at the border, when the container is opened, and a complete car is inside, some are not. 

Titling/ MOT/Registration is handled by the individual states. Each of the 50 states have their own requirements. Some states, like Florida, you can register anything, just pay the fees, pay the taxes, and you get a plate. So the guys import the cars as parts to bypass the Clean Air Act, then assemble them, and title them in Florida, etc. Its not a complicated process, proved by the mouth breathers at SKOUSA forums. However, it is illegal. 



mattysupra said:


> If you have not done all the above then the cars will get seized just like they would in the u.k if we drove it and it did not have the above would they not?


Some guys will have cars for years and years. They say that the laws do not apply to them. Eventually it catches up to them. This is what is happening, and now you have this group of illegal owners/importers crying about the process. 

Like buying a stolen car at a great price, it is up to the consumer to show due diligence on what he is buying. Some guys claim they were scammed by sellers, but its not difficult to find out proper information on this subject. 



mattysupra said:


> And finally, why cant you sell your 'illegal' cars to the U.K etc if there not allowed over there before they get seized?


They could.


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

SkylineUSA said:


> I could have sworn that was one of the issues with them closing down MotoRex, no OBDs installed.


You are wrong. If you need help with the big words in the article, let me know.
'MotoRex and the North American Skyline Fiasco" - the Skyline GT-R wiki




SkylineUSA said:


> Son, I see your reading comprehension is lacking, I never mention race vehicles.


Its funny, you try and use my own wit, and my own lines against me, and end up failing miserably. 

You quoted someone, and they were talking about race cars. Read it. Seriously. You are retarded aren't you? Damn, now I feel bad for arguing with you. Is your helmet on tight? 



> Quote:Originally Posted by mattysupra
> All these illegal cars are registered as race cars hence you can only use on the race track?
> 
> So if your not using the cars on the road and have the papework that tynedago has posted your o.k?
> ...





SkylineUSA said:


> And yes, there is a gray area. If that was not the case, why are there so many skylines in the States? Gray area....WINNING!!!!!!


Illegal. Lots of illegals. They just never did much about it the last 10 years. Just because you have a kilo of cocaine sitting on your dinning room table, does not make it legal. Just because you have an illegal, state titled Skyline in your garage does not make it legal.


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## EL MAMITO USMC (Dec 6, 2007)

i guess Mr Morris, this will be settle in a place that is not here.. so ill opcorn: and see whats up at the end.. ...

i just hope Mr Morris that you never and i mean NEVER need the assistance of any member from our community, because if that ever happen you'll get the same assistance and support that you have provided..


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## Eaze (Jun 19, 2009)

I won't lie the more and more I read the more I would hate to go back to the U.S. seems like to much BS over a car you want to own. Hate to see what money it would take to buy food if it was Germany in the 1920's all over again.


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## SkylineUSA (Jun 29, 2001)

01-07-2005, 02:28 PM 
tyndago 
Super Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Under a rock
Posts: 5,591 

Re: Motorex issues --- 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Quote:
Plus with the fact that Motorex never had a working OBDII system it would be harder, unless you guys already created one. 


Who ever said that there wasn't a working OBD II system ? Oh...maybe publically it was said. But, the system does exist. And it does work. It just needed a little bit more development and money.

There are 2 cars running around with OBD-II systems. "

Your words, sounds to me like they all did not work, aka you are full of sh!t.


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

EL MAMITO USMC said:


> i
> i just hope Mr Morris that you never and i mean NEVER need the assistance of any member from our community, because if that ever happen you'll get the same assistance and support that you have provided..


Ortiz,

What am I going to do with you? 

Assistance. Like the assistance you asked for, from me in an email March 13th? You really are that stupid aren't you? Just like the rest. 



> rom	SSGT ORTIZ MONSERRATE <[email protected]>
> to	[email protected]
> date	Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 8:42 PM
> subject	advise...
> ...


So about that? And yes, I responded to you with advice. Just like many others. Privately. If you want to come on here, and continue to talk, well, fine. I will bring it out in the public.


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## TAZZMAXX (Mar 9, 2010)

Can someone explain (in short) why America is so against the import of Skylines? Is it a right hand drive issue, safety, emissions etc. Is it just Skylines or does it extend to Supras, Scoobies and EVO's.

Maybe it relates to something a little further back in time?

I'm just intrigued and cannot see the big deal over it.


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

SkylineUSA said:


> 01-07-2005, 02:28 PM
> 
> 
> > tyndago
> ...


You really can't read can you? You still have no idea what you are talking about. Its amusing watching you flail about. 

Doing legal importing requires intelligence. This is the reason, our two friends here, that can neither spell "cummunity", or string logical sentences together, are getting their illegally imported cars seized.

Spell check Ortiz. Please. Please.


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

TAZZMAXX said:


> Can someone explain (in short) why America is so against the import of Skylines? Is it a right hand drive issue, safety, emissions etc. Is it just Skylines or does it extend to Supras, Scoobies and EVO's.
> 
> Maybe it relates to something a little further back in time?
> 
> I'm just intrigued and cannot see the big deal over it.


Mercedes Benz


This is the Reason the Nissan Skyline is Illegal in the US




> Its heard all the time on the internet, the Nissan Skyline is illegal in the USA. To the layperson, they may hear this and take it as gospel. It used to be you would hear its illegal because it is right hand drive. You would hear that it is illegal because it was too fast. Neither of which is true. Here is the true reason that the Nissan Skyline is illegal in the US, Mercedes Benz North America





> The grey market was successful enough that it ate significantly into the business of Mercedes-Benz of North America and their dealers. The corporation launched a successful million-dollar congressional lobbying effort to stop private importation of vehicles not officially intended for the U.S. market


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## SkylineUSA (Jun 29, 2001)

tyndago said:


> You really can't read can you? You still have no idea what you are talking about. Its amusing watching you flail about.
> 
> Doing legal importing requires intelligence. This is the reason, our two friends here, that can neither spell "cummunity", or string logical sentences together, are getting their illegally imported cars seized.
> 
> Spell check Ortiz. Please. Please.



You really are having a hard time understanding what you wrote? Does not shock me, one bit.

I am done, you have proven my point.


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## mattysupra (Oct 31, 2008)

tyndago , thanks for answering my questions. 


Well, i think you U.S lads need to be stripping and selling us Brits some parts. Because from where im sitting it looks like you have no chance of keeping your cars. Maybe with 1 million to front the law's with but i think you have no chance when Merc/BMW etc get involved. 

Truth! , i feel sorry for you all. But if you have broken the law, well you have broken the law.


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## TAZZMAXX (Mar 9, 2010)

Sean, thanks for clearing that up. I'm still confused though as I can understand Mercedes wanting to prevent someone buying a cheaper import but with Nissan, they never had an official car (Skyline) anyway, so how could the grey import be deemed to be damaging to possible lost revenue?


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## Mook (Mar 20, 2007)

The law is all encompassing I imagine


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## TAZZMAXX (Mar 9, 2010)

Mook said:


> The law is all encompassing I imagine


Obviously. I'd always thought there was a bit of a hidden agenda.


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## mattysupra (Oct 31, 2008)

TAZZMAXX said:


> Sean, thanks for clearing that up. I'm still confused though as I can understand Mercedes wanting to prevent someone buying a cheaper import but with Nissan, they never had an official car (Skyline) anyway, so how could the grey import be deemed to be damaging to possible lost revenue?


me too. 

But at the end of the day its a import. I think the issue is that Nissan dealers over in the US never took the car on. We in the u.k have middlehurst to thank for that.


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

TAZZMAXX said:


> Sean, thanks for clearing that up. I'm still confused though as I can understand Mercedes wanting to prevent someone buying a cheaper import but with Nissan, they never had an official car (Skyline) anyway, so how could the grey import be deemed to be damaging to possible lost revenue?


As said above, the vehicle import law is all encompassing. It's not just Mercedes, it's any non originally certified imported car. 

That is really the whole point, it's not the Skyline at all, it's the import laws. Mercedes spent a million in 1988 getting the laws changed to suit them. In 2011 it's going to cost a lot more. 

If the import law is changed today, the US distribution network could potentially lose sales to these imports. The exact amount is unknown, but they all have lobbyists an lawyers on staff. This is not something the owners of theses illegally imported cars have. You can see from the two stellar examples of owners in this thread(can't spell, can't put together a coherent argument, post a one sentence reply), that they would have a tough battle with the auto industry.


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## G18RST (Dec 23, 2006)

"I think the issue is that Nissan dealers over in the US never took the car on. We in the u.k have middlehurst to thank for that"

I hope my wife doesn`t see this, middlehurst will be sorry...


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

TAZZMAXX said:


> Sean, thanks for clearing that up. I'm still confused though as I can understand Mercedes wanting to prevent someone buying a cheaper import but with Nissan, they never had an official car (Skyline) anyway, so how could the grey import be deemed to be damaging to possible lost revenue?


Back in 2003, I did some work for a company that was contracted to try and import the Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution to the US. When the entire process started, the Evo was not imported. Without what is called a "substantially similar model", the DOT needs to have proof of crash worthiness/safety. Once the US model came out, I grabbed all the information I could get on the US model VIII, and prepared a petition for the JDM and Euro model VII and VIII. 

http://www.regulations.gov/#!docketDetail;dct=FR+PR+N+O+SR;rpp=10;po=0;D=NHTSA-2003-16031



> There are documents from me for the LHD Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution VII and VIII . The first few pages are the actual work . The rest of the pages are substantiating documentation from Mitsubishi press releases , and service manuals.It took me about a month to do the Mitsubishi petition . Get the paperwork and information together . Do the research , etc .
> 
> In February , 2003 I flew over to the DOT in Washington , DC and dropped off my petition . At first I bundled the VII and VIII together as they are on the same chassis CT9A . The DOT did not like this , and I had to go and split it into two petitions .
> 
> ...


The delays, the comments from Mitsubishi made it nearly impossible. They said that all the interior panels were different from the US car to the Euro car. I took a US car apart, and a Euro car apart, took photos of all the parts side by side, and showed they were in fact the same part number. The OEM can say anything they want, without proof. The RI must backup every claim with proof. 

It would have took more money than the customer wanted to spend, to actually make it happen.


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## EL MAMITO USMC (Dec 6, 2007)

tyndago said:


> Ortiz,
> 
> What am I going to do with you?
> 
> ...


the problem Mr. Morris is no the advise that you mirth or mirth not give me or us, but why the *lack of respect and insults*. that is what really pisses me off. did I ever insulted you or called you stupid? i asked you PRIVATELY because I'm sure you have more experience in doing this than me and i considered you a professional and if you had any issues or derogatory comments to other members that was not my personal problem, and that rage wasn't going to be directed toward me, but apparently not. 

Have a nice day...


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## Eaze (Jun 19, 2009)

Only if the Skyline was sold in the states to begin with. :chairshot


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

EL MAMITO USMC said:


> but why the *lack of respect and insults*. that is what really pisses me off. did I ever insulted you or called you stupid? i asked you PRIVATELY because I'm sure you have more experience in doing this than me and i considered you a professional and if you had any issues or derogatory comments to other members that was not my personal problem, and that rage wasn't going to be directed toward me, but apparently not.


Spell check and complete sentences are still a bitch for you right? I call an idiot an idiot, and you kids over there are going to have to live with that.

*I don't sugar coat bullshit, and call it alright*. I did not do to you, what Steve did to you. When he was in the middle of getting his car seized, he was telling everyone that everything was ok.

REASONS FOR CALLING SOUSA MEMBERS IDIOTS

1) Did he or did he not say that everything was ok, and that nothing had been seized, after he had been visited by ICE, and they told him they were coming back to seize his car?

The facts are I am calling you guys idiots, and you can't handle that. What you need to worry about, are the guys that are coming to seize your cars. They won't call you idiots, they will just take your cars. Your skin is so thin, you are going to have some issues.

Go back to the thread when I STARTED calling people idiots. I am blocked from it now, surprisingly... 

2) I was posting relevant information, and your members, your friends from the forum, instead to go and post about breasts? The owner of the forum is getting his car seized, I am trying to give members relevant information, and they go and **** off? Just not right. 

3) You own an illegal car. If you had due diligence, you could have figured this out on your own. Instead you want to bypass the legal importation route. You guys are so smart, *the rules do not apply to you?*

4) The owner of your forums tampered with evidence. Instead of either a)letting them seize the car whole b)moving the car c)getting a lawyer, your GENIUS decided that tampering with the evidence by disassembling a complete car was the way to go. 

There are your quick four reasons for calling you guys IDIOTS. Why help IDIOTS, when they know it all themselves? They just come out and attack me, question me? 

I have nothing to lose, and nothing to gain by the whole situation. However, you guys have your cars to lose. Listening, and not being idiots would have been one smart step, but again and again, you prove that you can not do that.

Just look at poor SkylineUSA, that guy come back with one sentence come backs, which seem more like they are constructed by a 12 year old. Perhaps that is really the intelligence level over there. Knuckle dragging mouth breathers that I don't want to be associated with. I felt like I should be giving him a "Time Out" so he could have some extra time to construct and argument. Maybe sent it to his Mum for her to read over, correct and send back. 

Ortiz, you guys are going to fail miserably. You guys lack everything that is needed to enact change. Mark my words.


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## EL MAMITO USMC (Dec 6, 2007)

tyndago said:


> Spell check and complete sentences are still a bitch for you right?


humm interesting when a first language English speaking guy can't determine when to use "GRAY" or "GREY" in a hole post, not just a sentence..

but its OK i guess this is not the place or time to insult each other. 

and just for the reference I do make sufficient money to allow my self to loose the non rolling chassis sitting in my garage but like any good Marine, we don't go down with out a fight .... 

thank you for your information and your insults, have a nice day .. snitch


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## Andy W (Dec 31, 2005)

how can it be legal to own an AK47 but be illegal to own an imported car in the US ?

you guys have some bright people incharge of things over there


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## matty32 (Dec 18, 2005)

tbh who cares its the states


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## EL MAMITO USMC (Dec 6, 2007)

Andy W said:


> how can it be legal to own an AK47 but be illegal to own an imported car in the US ?
> 
> you guys have some bright people incharge of things over there


like you have no idea.. i dont move to Mexico, because i have a nice paying job in the US, if not ill be dacing rancheras and "El Pasito Duranguense" long time ago..


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## Andy W (Dec 31, 2005)

This is road legal over here 

Man drives his sofa at 92mph | The Sun |News


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## mattysupra (Oct 31, 2008)

Andy W said:


> how can it be legal to own an AK47 but be illegal to own an imported car in the US ?
> 
> you guys have some bright people incharge of things over there


LOL, yep. One f'ed up place to live.


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## Nigel-Power (Dec 16, 2009)

This is unbelievable, getting your pride and joy seized... totally out of order.


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

Andy W said:


> how can it be legal to own an AK47 but be illegal to own an imported car in the US ?
> 
> you guys have some bright people incharge of things over there


Money and lobbying power. The 2nd amendment allows the right to bear arms. Hand gun or AK47 as long as it meets requirements it's ok. You can't just have any and every gun without the right permissions. 

There is no amendment that allows you to have whatever you want, just because you do. 

There are vehicle import laws and they should be followed. If they are not then prepare yourself for the consequences.


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## tyndago (Oct 24, 2002)

EL MAMITO USMC said:


> humm interesting when a first language English speaking guy can't determine when to use "GRAY" or "GREY" in a hole post, not just a sentence..
> 
> . snitch



Gray and Grey are both correct. In the US generally it's grey, but the rest of the English speaking world generally uses gray. 

I find it really amusing that you post to give me a hard time over that and write "hole" which means something missing/ open space when you should have written "whole" which means the entire thing. 

You flail and continue to look like an idiot. Unable to answer the real questions but resort to only calling me names. 

Call me a snitch, I'm not the one losing my illegally imported car, you are.


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## Rain (Apr 8, 2006)

Andy, there are still some guns that regular Americans cannot own, i THINK i remember reading about some swiss made tiny hand gun that was banned in the US cause it was so small it could be hidden too easily or something...even tho the round itself was not fatal...could be wrong just going by my (these days) horrible memory.

Here we go Untitled Page

Same deal here, does not meet gov. requirements, so, sorry Joe public no deal.

I think the Skyline goes under the; "Too much awesomeness for importation" clause.


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## Andy W (Dec 31, 2005)

tyndago said:


> Money and lobbying power. The 2nd amendment allows the right to bear arms. Hand gun or AK47 as long as it meets requirements it's ok. You can't just have any and every gun without the right permissions.
> 
> There is no amendment that allows you to have whatever you want, just because you do.
> 
> There are vehicle import laws and they should be followed. If they are not then prepare yourself for the consequences.


I think i'd be a lot happier with my nextdoor neighbour having the right to own a R33 gtr rather than an AK47 even more so if he was as dumb as Bush


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## lgunnz (Jan 28, 2010)

For those that feel this is a bad time for this, you might want to look into when this started: weeks before Japan was rocked. And I'm closer to this subject then most of you since I have seen the destruction with my own eyes being a 3 hour drive from the area that was rocked the worse and a mere 10 minutes drive from being swept into the ocean.

My second point is: why all the in-fighting? Do you really feel that this issue will go away for those of us in the states when the 25 year rule comes into play for Skylines? I guarantee this is merely the tip of the iceberg. I've seen the way the US government handles things like this. A new rule will be in effect that will eliminate that.


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## signalr32 (Mar 21, 2011)

Hey Sean is an awesome guy, and is totally correct. Everyone in the US knew that when Motorex closed there was NO real legit way to get a GTR. The Kaizo owners honestly knew it, they just hoped to never get caught. Even RBmotoring knew they couldnt import GT-Rs. The problem is the government in my opinion must have gotten pissed they had one pulled over on them. 

I am lucky enough though to own a GTR that was brought in by Motorex and is one of the very few that are Cali legal.. 

The thing is Americans will cut any corner they can, and when they get slap for doing so, get pissed...

I would rather donate money to a poor guy in the rain then the guys that bought Kaizo cars.. Not my problem they cut corners and then got caught. LOL


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