# Airtec GTR intercooler



## aki (May 1, 2003)

Anyone tried one of these Airtec intercoolers?
Seems pretty good price for what is being offered? They also mention working with Kaiser Motorsport to develop the intercooler.

https://www.airtecmotorsport.com/product/airtec-intercooler-upgrade-for-nissan-r35-gt-r/


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

Ys, not impressed.


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## aki (May 1, 2003)

What was the problem with it?
Fitment issue or less than expected performance?




dudersvr said:


> Ys, not impressed.


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## dtox (Sep 21, 2009)

looks exactly like my ACspeedtech IC or even the AMS Street for half the price. I paid £1200 all in so for £400 cheaper it is a bargain I would buy it for sure

not seen facts or figures yet but they will come


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

aki said:


> What was the problem with it?
> Fitment issue or less than expected performance?


It was on their development vehicle which a customer bought, air intake temps were not impressive and it seemed to make the car Laggy, however I think it was a bigger version than that, either way he took it off, I believe he went with an ACS one which we know works well.


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

dtox said:


> looks exactly like my ACspeedtech IC or even the AMS Street for half the price. I paid £1200 all in so for £400 cheaper it is a bargain I would buy it for sure
> 
> not seen facts or figures yet but they will come


A MR2 ferrari kit can look just like a 355 but it dont go like one, theres way more to an IC than exterior dimensions and like most things in life you get what you pay for!! 
'Excuse me, why is that parachute so much cheaper than all
the others? Well its from an unknown company in china,
has no real development and its been on the shelf for a good
few years!'

Great, I'll take it. My husband will love this !!!!!!:chuckle:


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## terry lloyd (Feb 12, 2014)

They worked well on a focus RS - no issues with fitting either - downside was they were very heavy


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## WingedBeast1968 (Sep 18, 2009)

Seems okay. They don***8217;t make their own cores, just fabricate the end tanks and pipes. I can***8217;t see how they could have ****ed that up :chuckle:


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

WingedBeast1968 said:


> Seems okay. They don***8217;t make their own cores, just fabricate the end tanks and pipes. I can***8217;t see how they could have ****ed that up :chuckle:


Again it depends what cores they use
Also depends whether the core is separated in the middle or is just one unit.


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## Scott (Jun 29, 2001)

Those *bar & plate* cores are a cheap inefficient design. I'd avoid personally.


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## aki (May 1, 2003)

I was under the impression that most of the aftermarket intercoolers for the GTR were Bar & Plate construction? Are you saying that B&P core is no good or that this particular B&P core is no good?

I wish these companies would actually publish data which quantifiably demonstrates how much improvement their product gives over factory intercooler. So far I've only noticed Litchfield publishing their data.


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

I know my BL Race is unreal, 28/9 degree ambient 3 laps in at Brands 32 degrees
ACS street works VERY well up to 850/900 I had that before.


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## Scott (Jun 29, 2001)

B&P, (as you're calling them), are quite good for flow, as the cross section in the Bars is quite large. But the whole point of an intercooler is to cool the charge air and they do this by running the hot charge air over the surface of the aliminium which is cooled by cooler ambient air, and so the bigger the surface area the better. The higher efficient types use thinner tubes for the charge to flow through, these often have ribs inside to increase the surface area and therefore cooling potential. This types are usually more expensive to produce as they have more weld to perform on thinner smaller joints. But in my opinion they are worth it.

As has been said above, you get what you pay for.


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

It amazes me how we drive a relatively expensive car but seem to want to buy the cheapest parts available for them. Caveat being items that are known to work etc.


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## terry lloyd (Feb 12, 2014)

I am surprised no one has developed a water cooled (charge cooler) system yet - have used these on a few builds - very effective for road / track days


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## gtr mart (Mar 29, 2004)

Common in the states for big power builds. I imagine Jamie at Evotune will be running water cooled on his front mounts too.


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## WingedBeast1968 (Sep 18, 2009)

All I need to know is is it better than stock? I reckon it is, so it’s good enough.

The days of the GT-R tax are ending, hoorah!

:squintdan


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

WingedBeast1968 said:


> All I need to know is is it better than stock? I reckon it is, so it***8217;s good enough.
> 
> The days of the GT-R tax are ending, hoorah!
> 
> :squintdan


Probably not, after all did Nissan think OK this is the flag ship Nissan lets put some shite intercoolers in it?
Pretty soon we will get into the same situation as the yanks, big power builds by the big name shops are easy to shift for reasonable money but a build by SBD is like a stone and proof is true his cars dont run the same numbers, time comes to sell the car with the better parts will sell as not only is it far better spec but it shows the owner did not skimp on anything or cut corners, remember 

'Cheap is expensive, Expensive is cheap'

After you blow up 4 engines with cheap parts and same with trans people realise this.


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

These work well, much bigger cores with bigger tubes and turbonators inside and still 2 separate cores like stock.


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## terry lloyd (Feb 12, 2014)

The good old days £360


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## aki (May 1, 2003)

Which brand intercoolers are those?




dudersvr said:


> These work well, much bigger cores with bigger tubes and turbonators inside and still 2 separate cores like stock.
> 
> View attachment 248405
> 
> ...


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

terry lloyd said:


> The good old days £360


As opposed to £4k


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

The greddy stock replacement is a beautiful design from a company that does a lot of R&D, for example not only does it come with a very expensive core design but a lovely little touch like these air ducts that funnel the max amount of air to the coolers and not round it, cooler the charge the more power.Fitting these as we speak.

















And without diverter plate like stock

















Amazes me how many cars have extremely expensive coolers and no ducting and my pet hate no mounting straps from the crash bar to splitter which is all that holds it on at speed.


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## gtr mart (Mar 29, 2004)

Funny you say that John about the ducting. I've said this for a while now. Do those air ducts seal to the intercooler? I have ducting on mine but it doesn't currently seal on the face so pressure build on the core is reduced.


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## terry lloyd (Feb 12, 2014)

Maybe of some help Martin , I drilled and tapped (short 5mm bolts) plates on the side of the intercooler run them up to the splitter supports and bolted too them. Done this on both my intercoolers


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

terry lloyd said:


> Maybe of some help Martin , I drilled and tapped (short 5mm bolts) plates on the side of the intercooler run them up to the splitter supports and bolted too them. Done this on both my intercoolers


Only problem with bolting splitter to cooler is the pressure on the splitter moving and cracking the cooler, the 3 struts that support the splitter are straight when new, every car I see they are z shaped where the splitter has moved upwards and they have concertinaed shortening by maybe 15mm, I believe they are designed this way and a solid mount to an aluminium cooler may not be a good idea in the long run.


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

gtr mart said:


> Funny you say that John about the ducting. I've said this for a while now. Do those air ducts seal to the intercooler? I have ducting on mine but it doesn't currently seal on the face so pressure build on the core is reduced.


I was told a long time ago the sealing of an IC in a duct to the air source is extremely important, im sure Ian will confirm this, however how much it will effect overall power in effort/£/return on a road car im not sure. On a race car where 5hp may be difference between 1/2/3 it prob is.


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## Scott (Jun 29, 2001)

Intercoolers aren't designed to be structural!!

If you drill & tap the end tanks, be sure to check for swarf!


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

Scott said:


> Intercoolers aren't designed to be structural!!
> 
> If you drill & tap the end tanks, be sure to check for swarf!


So I shouldnt be using one as an engine mount then :chuckle:


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## terry lloyd (Feb 12, 2014)

Good point John as you say the supports can bend typical Nissan metal  - I did not think of that, I figured/read ducting was important as the air can bounce off the front of the intercooler and go round it 
Scott if you were referring to my comment about drilling & tapping, the side plates do not have airflow they are just the frame work of the cooler


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## gtr mart (Mar 29, 2004)

I already have plates on mine. Boxing any air heat exchanger makes sense. Huge gains in efficiency. I'm running an ETS street on the edge of what it is capable of and was hoping to take a decent amount of Inlet temp out when being pushed.

Mine doesn't have a seal between the cooler and the plates which I think would help alot.

Chatting with Iain Litchfield he mentioned that if the radiator has crap in it then it can effect the flow through it and thus you get pressure build up between the rad and the intercooler which is not good atall. I'd almost go as far to say that positive pressure on the back of the cooler will outweigh most effort for ducting air into the front of it.


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## WingedBeast1968 (Sep 18, 2009)

I’ve bought one. We shall see


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

WingedBeast1968 said:


> I’ve bought one. We shall see


Do you have SD kit on your car?


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

aki said:


> Which brand intercoolers are those?


Sorry missed this, Greddy and car is working very well with them on.


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## WingedBeast1968 (Sep 18, 2009)

dudersvr said:


> Do you have SD kit on your car?


Nope, still Mafs. I’ll try to get some temperature data though. Before and after.


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

WingedBeast1968 said:


> Nope, still Mafs. I’ll try to get some temperature data though. Before and after.


You need SD to get proper temp readings


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## WingedBeast1968 (Sep 18, 2009)

Agreed, I’ll think of something. A relative difference between stock and Airtech is all I’m interested in. They say it was designed to support stage 4.
It’s also two separate air coolers, from one core. I made sure of that. And I prefer welded end tanks, not the crimped on leaky shit from Nissan.

I’ve got some thermocouples around here somewhere, and some of that special tape. We destroy all sorts at work, and find out how hot it got :chuckle:


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

Try measure charge temp close to throttle body :squintdan


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## jimbo1234567 (Sep 17, 2018)

do these have a stock ait sensor in the inlet mani or somewhere nearby


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## gtr mart (Mar 29, 2004)

tends to be the MAF which is before the turbos so mostly useless. Once you go SD tune it moves the inlet temp sensor up towards the engine and essentially after the turbo and intercoolers so you get a meaningful inlet temp reading.


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## jimbo1234567 (Sep 17, 2018)

having the ait sensor as part of the maf is totally useless, it needs to be somewhere after the intercooler and before the engine to accurately see how well the turbos are doing at producing heat and how efficient the intercooler is. audi have been putting this sensor in the inlet mani for over 20 years so im quite surprised here.


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## gtr mart (Mar 29, 2004)

For what Nissan needed it to do, it did it just fine. On a stock car in most situations the parameters and mapping worked well and I guess they only needed to know the ambient temp of the air coming in. 

Even at stage 4 with turbos maxed out the scaling worked well enough. I suspect it's cheaper to do and on a fairly mass produced car it makes sense. Also cars tend to run a little better at low and part loads with MAF sensors and the GT-R needs all the help it can get with that :chuckle:


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## dudersvr (May 7, 2003)

jimbo1234567 said:


> having the ait sensor as part of the maf is totally useless, it needs to be somewhere after the intercooler and before the engine to accurately see how well the turbos are doing at producing heat and how efficient the intercooler is. audi have been putting this sensor in the inlet mani for over 20 years so im quite surprised here.


Yes we said that a page back and as Mart said MAF tune works very well on a reasonably stock car but a SD tune is used as power goes up.


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## WingedBeast1968 (Sep 18, 2009)

So this came in the post yesterday 

























Fitting today, after a pressure test.

Initial impression is it’s a bit agricultural. Probably nothing wrong with it functionally, but the esthetics could do with improvement. The powder coating has been applied over corrosion in a couple of spots, and the red lettering isn’t as crisp as it could be. Maybe £4K gets you there, but £795 doesn’t :chuckle:


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## dtox (Sep 21, 2009)

Looks great and for that price you can***8217;t moan will be amazing ***x1f642;


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## WingedBeast1968 (Sep 18, 2009)

It is on. Straight forward install, nothing out of the ordinary to report. Took about 2.5 hours start to test drive. Logging tomorrow.

It doesn’t actually look much different in size to the stock intercoolers.


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## gtr mart (Mar 29, 2004)

Nice work. Doing it in my dark garage on jack stands when I had a bit of time here and there it took me a few weeks 

Does you number plate intentionally read as GAY ZILLA? Not knocking it, just interested.


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## WingedBeast1968 (Sep 18, 2009)

Sadly for you, no. It’s a little Japanese old timer saying Godzilla. :chuckle:


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## aki (May 1, 2003)

What was the results of fitting this intercooler, was there a significant drop in AIT?




WingedBeast1968 said:


> So this came in the post yesterday
> 
> View attachment 249139
> 
> ...


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## Juice (Jun 21, 2009)

Also interested in results


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## m1ac_drew (Apr 2, 2002)

I've got one of these on order with a four-week lead time. Would be good to know if the data supports them or not, as I still have time to cancel it!

I went for plain silver without the lettering...


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## m1ac_drew (Apr 2, 2002)

Decided to hold off for now, as the benefits are not apparent and I need to finish the fluid cooling upgrades first. Might consider the Litchfield Super Stock intercooler later on...


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## terry lloyd (Feb 12, 2014)

Go for a race size intercooler or don't bother


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## m1ac_drew (Apr 2, 2002)

Been advised by Litchfield that a race intercooler for 4.25 is overkill; they're best suited to 4.5 and up. What stage tune are you running?


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## terry lloyd (Feb 12, 2014)

Personally I struggle to see how you get decent gains putting another intercooler in the same size hole - after a lot of searching mainly in the US the consensus was go big or go home, Also the smaller the turbos the hotter the temps will be to get more power


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## WingedBeast1968 (Sep 18, 2009)

I’m happy with it. The flanged connector stubs are gone and it’s all welded, so no crimped on end tanks. Simpler is better.


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## m1ac_drew (Apr 2, 2002)

terry lloyd said:


> Personally I struggle to see how you get decent gains putting another intercooler in the same size hole - after a lot of searching mainly in the US the consensus was go big or go home, Also the smaller the turbos the hotter the temps will be to get more power


If all intercoolers were equal in performance at a given size, why does a HKS cost a lot more than Airtec? 

While size may be a factor in comparison, there are other facts such as design, construction, materials etc. 

What's the biggest power increase someone has seen purely from fitting a full-size race intercooler to a 4.25 car? That would make for an interesting metric.


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## m1ac_drew (Apr 2, 2002)

I found an answer to that question here:

https://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=526210

I think my money will be better spent elsewhere, the stock intercooler is sized for the stock turbos, and doesn't need to be changed under 700BHP. The main measurable benefit isn't an increase in power but a reduction in heat soak.


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## terry lloyd (Feb 12, 2014)

The Hks is a race size intercooler - it also came with a full carbon fibre duct to aid cooling for the intercooler and water radiator

https://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/468641-3k-hks-intercooler-vs-300-ebay-intercooler.html


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