# IMPORTANT - Was combining R35 and Previous generation model forums a bad idea?



## Blow Dog (Sep 4, 2001)

G'day all.

We've been closely monitoring the status of this forum change, where we combined both the existing R35 chat sub forum, with that of the existing RB26 sub forums (R32 - R34's).

From the very off, it was obvious that many of you didn't like the move and were also quite vocal about it. I did ask that you provide us with a little patience to monitor the change and thanks to you all, we've been able to review the situation.

This forum is only as good as the contribution of its users, so I now place the decision firmly in your hands. Please make your vote (it's a public vote) known so that we can either leave the move as is, or migrate it back to how it was before.

The mods and I all feel that we've probably made the wrong decision, however it's very important to know the reasons for the change. We're simply trying to provide further community integration between all the cars. It may be that this was the wrong way of doing it, so I'll politely ask you all to reinforce your votes with ideas, suggestions and opinions as to how we can focus on that issue.

Meanwhile, I'm happy to announce that the site rebuild is going very well indeed. We've got some incredible developments and we're taking this site properly into the next decade with style. I've got my personal digital comms company building this, so it's not a bedroom coded affair but a proper, commissioned agency project that is documenting the build progress. I really want to show you these designs, but there are some pretty cute new things we're throwing in that I really am loathe to share with the world until we're live.

I do, however, really need your input. Going forwards, we'll place decisions well and truly in your hands. To that end, we need your comments in a site survey that's due to go live soon. I would respectfully ask that EVERY single one of you contribute to this. This is not just for GTROC members, but for every user of this forum.

Thanks all.

Admin Team


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## Mookistar (Feb 5, 2004)

Can I just reiterate Cem's comments about integration. I see a few people have already voted.

What we need to remember, is this site is not Wikipedia. It's not just a source of info. It's a community. A community of people with shared interests, and we need to cater for those interests as fairly as possible.

So, if possible, instead of just casting a vote, perhaps comment on how we can ensure that the 35 owners are as involved in daily forum life as much the established Skyline owners are, and how the existing Skyline owners can be drawn into, and involved in, the exciting world of the next generation GTR.

Afterall, in 10 years time, this place will still be here and we need to make sure the scene is cohesive.



Mook


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## miragev (Apr 11, 2007)

i like to read about all the gtr's 
but i get the feeling alot(but obviously not all ) of the the new 35 owners are not intrested in the gtr's heritage
and that they are just passengers in the gtr experience and when their ride is over and something better arrives they will simply get off and move onto another ride without batting an eye ...
some of them seem to think that people who do not have a 35 can't afford one or similar ..but not everybody wants one ..!!
i voted revert back to the old system
and maybe think about condensing some of the old cats togeather like turbo's... engine mods etc as i think then they would get a lot more hits it's a bit of a pain having to look through each cat... individually ....sorry if i offended anybody just my 2 euros ..


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## Blow Dog (Sep 4, 2001)

miragev said:


> i like to read about all the gtr's
> but i get the feeling alot(but obviously not all ) of the the new 35 owners are not intrested in the gtr's heritage
> and that they are just passengers in the gtr experience and when their ride is over and something better arrives they will simply get off and move onto another ride without batting an eye ...
> some of them seem to think that people who do not have a 35 can't afford one or similar ..but not everybody wants one ..!!
> ...


Interesting point about combining some of the tech forums.
Thanks.


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## agent-x (Jul 26, 2008)

i totally agree with miragev

as much as i like reading about the 35's most people join ask a question and p!s5 off

its about the community like mook said

i think i will wait to see a few more votes before i decide as i want to read about 35's but i also want the community side, also thinking about the community it could mean two or more communities are coming together

dont know what to do as yet lets hear a few more views :thumbsup: opcorn:


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## mambastu (Feb 13, 2002)

miragev said:


> i like to read about all the gtr's
> but i get the feeling alot(but obviously not all ) of the the new 35 owners are not intrested in the gtr's heritage
> and that they are just passengers in the gtr experience and when their ride is over and something better arrives they will simply get off and move onto another ride without batting an eye ...
> some of them seem to think that people who do not have a 35 can't afford one or similar ..but not everybody wants one ..!!


Summed up perfectly and better than I could have :thumbsup:


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## Wildrover (Dec 16, 2008)

Well, all I can say hats off to you guys - at least you are prepared to gauge feeling and even admit you made a mistake.

Can't be fairer than that and I'm sure the posts will benefit if you revert to a R35 Chit-Chat Forum.

Cem - just a reminder and I'm sure you are well aware of it as I did post on it before - but the thread disappeared. 

Vbulletin 4 is around the corner. Supposedly a complete revision.......just a thought.


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## souroull (Jul 21, 2008)

the ownerbase and concerns between the generations is vast.

example:

r32/33/34 = way more technical and involved, engines, tuners and the likes
r35= satnav, 1k quid oil changes, light upgrades, warranty, gearbox

completely different ownerbase, completely different cars.

personally, i liked this forum a lot better than the ones with higher traffic because its (was) structurally correct. 

my .2


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## davew (Apr 28, 2003)

mambastu said:


> Summed up perfectly and better than I could have :thumbsup:


I feel that whilst some 35 owners may not be interested in the 'Heritage' that given time they would eventually start to read other threads and then perhaps engage in some cross chat. 
I remember when i first joined the forum that it seemed to take me ages to get people to talk to me on line, reply to my threads and acknowledge me as a forum member. 
So i say give it some time and leave it as it was, these new users are still a minority and just need more time to intergrate.

Just my views, feel free to shoot me down but its early days yet for these guys.

There isnt a button for this LOL!


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## Wildrover (Dec 16, 2008)

Can I just answer some typical view points about R35 owners.

I like all GT-Rs and Skylines. I'm also sure most R35 owners know about previous generation cars - but that doesn't mean we want to discuss them all the time. Hope that comes over as very fair.

Also, sure that most owners are not one car wonders - I personally will be keeping my car for some time.

If integration is a problem - surely owners meets and other such events are the places for this?


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## Mook (Mar 20, 2007)

Wildrover said:


> If integration is a problem - surely owners meets and other such events are the places for this?


that was one of the main reasons for the change. As many a 35 owner has confirmed they only ever read the 35 section, and simply didn't check the meetings sections or read about meets etc posted in the Skyline sections

we don't want to have to repeat every thread just to involve them

I had suggested an "r35 chat section" for idle 35 chat about sat navs and wheel jacks etc

a " gtr chat section" for things like ring times, heritage etc

and a "skyline chat section" for skyline chat

but is 3 better than 2?

Mook

Mook


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## Wildrover (Dec 16, 2008)

Mook said:


> that was one of the main reasons for the change. As many a 35 owner has confirmed they only ever read the 35 section, and simply didn't check the meetings sections or read about meets etc posted in the Skyline sections
> 
> we don't want to have to repeat every thread just to involve them
> 
> ...


Don't know if it will be better or not - but worth a try.


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## Blow Dog (Sep 4, 2001)

Wildrover said:


> Vbulletin 4 is around the corner. Supposedly a complete revision.......just a thought.


Yup - we've been watching it like a hawk, but our opinion is that it's months from launch, we'll be live way before then.


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## blue34 (Jul 28, 2005)

I voted to keep it integrated because that's the way I'd like it, because I'm interested in all the cars - but then that's just me. 

However I'm not at all suprised a lot of the new-to-GTR owners aren't in the least interested in the older cars or the RB chat so let them have their own section.

I posted the Bruntingthorpe event info in the 35 chitchat section - at first there was no reply or interest shown but after some hard sell eventually a few people signed up then some more and eventually the best individual model turn out on the day was from the 35 owners. 

So long as everyone is reminded to look in Meetings and Events even if that means duplicate posts then those that want to, will become part of the GTROC and GTR community.


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## EvolutionVI (Sep 6, 2005)

I have chosen the old form,i did like it much more......:wavey:

I mean im reading all the threads which are important for me or interesting anyway...but it makes it easier to find threads and tbh,if someone is not interested in the old models,then it makes his community life even better as he is not frustrated when he opens the 3rd "old GTR" thread in a row......

@Blowdog and Mods: Really like the way you are doing all your work,allways having a open ear for us,that you cant make it after everyones taste,is normal,but your trying your best to do so:bowdown1::bowdown1::bowdown1:


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## Alan (Jul 1, 2001)

I would prefer to read about all GTR,s to compare etc


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## yokohamaGTR (Jul 19, 2008)

*Poll Choices*

Are a little misleading. Voting to change it back the way it was is not equal to only wanting to read about your own car. It's about organizing the threads in a meaningful way so it's easier to find the ones you are looking for... to be able to prioritize the time spent on the site.

Personally I have stopped coming to the site completely since the change, because when I have 15m, too much of that time was spent browsing threads that might be interesting if I had more time, just not right then. Also wrt the comment about "paying your taxes" to have your voice heard, the flip side is existing tax payers may decide it's not worth the bother and just stop... I know my renewal reminder came at exactly the "wrong" moment.


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## FlowersGTR (Mar 30, 2008)

im a new r35 owner and i prefer this set up, i like to hear about some proper GTR talk, i agree that some of the talk in the r35 section is a bit pathetic and pointless (ive contributed enough to that lol) but now i think it might bring the the r35 owners together with the older skyline/GTR owners.
As regards a lack of threads regarding tuning and that on the r35 section the car hasnt even been out 6months and for alot of people its fast enough already. i know of one dealer that is already looking into engine mods for the r35 when ppl stop worrying about their warrenty.
i think the warrenty talk has died down now that people have got their cars but there is still that thought that if they did modify their cars and the transmission did blow nissan might slap a £18,000 price tag for a new one on us, £18,000 is a lot of money for me.
i voted to keep it as it is now :thumbsup:


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## CJay (Mar 23, 2008)

My focus & Interest is mainly on the R35 GTR , before the change I used to look at the other car threads ocassionally but now view them a bit more so the move has been a sucess from where I sit :bowdown1: 

I go to quite a few Car shows throughout the year not just Jap and always look out for GTRROC so as to admire all members cars, and I confess to never wanting to own any previous Skylines.

I would of thought most Petrol heads would show an interest in all the previous cars R32/ R33/ R34  


Rgds CJ


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## johnhanton57 (May 2, 2009)

I liked the old format just because it seemed easier to find what you wanted in the limited time you have but am also interested in all Skylines. New site if better organised with sections that are less broad would be my prefrence so you can home in on what you want quickly and then if you have time also look at other interesting posts


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## peterpeter (Feb 24, 2008)

I preferred the old format personally.
There seemed something more relevant on the chit chat thread each time I visited it.
I can see the benefit in bringing forums together but Im certainly visiting it a bit less now.


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## gtrlux (Mar 8, 2006)

I voted for reverting back!

But I also do not think that the forum section composition was optimal before. This is the GTR register , why not combine most of these tech forums in favor of 4 separate "GTR" sections, with each sub sections for tech/general chat and a gallery. (for 32/33/34/35). This would facilitate a search considerabely, as for exemple you know that in the R32-gallery you will only find R32s and not need to decrypt the thread titles in order to find out what car pics maybe inside that thread. Also is it a shame, considering that there have been posted incredible photographic content in the members gallery, that it just looks like a big pot, with no chance to find back a specific pic or search for one, as the posters don't tag or title the posts appropriately!

Also do I think that it is unfair to favorize an R35 section, there are more skyline owners out there , as there will ever be R35 owners, so 4 sections make sense. 

Here is a little idea:
*
GTR Register Main Forums:*
*- R35 GTR general chat*
---- R35 GTR members gallery
---- R35 GTR tech forum
*- R34 GTR general chat*
---- R34 GTR members gallery
---- R34 GTR tech forum
*- R33 GTR general chat*
---- R33 GTR members gallery
---- R33 GTR tech forum
*- R32 GTR general chat*
---- R32 GTR members gallery
---- R32 GTR tech forum

*
Nissan Skyline and Stagea Forums:*
*- Skylines general chat*
---- Skylines members gallery
---- Skylines tech forum
*- Stagea general chat*
---- Stagea members gallery
---- Stagea tech forum


ex . . . . . . then the rest of the non-related forums, trader sections, for sales sections and GTROC club forums.

At the end of the day it maybe not possible to influence people to look at all sections . . .. I have been here a while and posted a lot, but there are section I probably have visited only few times . .that's life. 

or just regroupe everything just under one section , one like this:
*-GTRLUX 18+ explecite GTAAAR forum:*


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## Guy (Jun 27, 2001)

I think it's a little unfair to title the poll the way it has been titled. I don't think that all R35 owners don't want to read about the other models, or don't favour some form of integration. However as has been said before the issues facing R35 owners are very different from the issues/concerns facing the other cars. The R35 is a new £60k car, being supplied by a main dealer, with warranty and most will remain standard or only very slightly modified (perhaps a cosmetic addition of a y-pipe/chip). 

It's not that I personally don't respect the other chit-chat subjects about the older models, but the majority of the issues posted are just not relevant in the way they are to the R32-4, which actually all share a very common mechanical platform, to the extent that a lot of the issues are common across these three platforms and parts interchangeable etc.

The GTROC has done some great work getting the Club info packs into the hands of the new owners of R35s and it's very important that if they do find there way onto here, that they can easily fall into a forum of like-minded R35 owners discussing relevant issues to them. If they don't they will not stay.

It will be very easy to steer people in here to the other Club/Events sections to integrate them over time, but build the R35 community first. Perhaps you should have an R35 Moderator, who could be responsible for that section and also for ensuring that the R35 forums do not remain isolated (and no I'm not volunteering, I did my bit on here years ago!).

All IMHO of course!


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## kpkpkp (Dec 1, 2007)

Wildrover said:


> Can I just answer some typical view points about R35 owners.
> 
> I like all GT-Rs and Skylines. I'm also sure most R35 owners know about previous generation cars - but that doesn't mean we want to discuss them all the time. Hope that comes over as very fair.


I feel the same - I have a GTR R35 Skyline whatever, I would like a section about it for chat. That said I love the R33 and as for the R34 cash permitting I will buy one next year. I read all the sections but as the R35 chat is a big one from me and for the time being I think it is better left on its own. When it gets bigger then I think the intergration is the way forward but at the mo the R35 posts just get lost amongst all the other R32,33 and 34 posts.

I know I am going to get shot down for this but I dont think the poll is fair as the R35 owners are in such a minority that I think even if we all vote for the R35 section to go back to the way it was there are so many other R owners that we will just get lost in the ratios.

Other than that I love the forum, meets and all the other stuff and check it out at least twice a day.

Kp


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## SeR GTR (Jul 5, 2009)

I like to read about all GTRs! But not all of the R35 owners does not want to learn about the heritage of the "Godzilla", some R35 owners I know do... And guess what, by the time they've known the car's legendary heritage they are even more proud that they own a GT-R. :bowdown1:


gtrlux said:


> Here is a little idea:
> *
> GTR Register Main Forums:*
> *- R35 GTR general chat*
> ...


Hey I kinda like this idea of separating the GTR from the Stageas and GTS-Ts... Main GTR forums then the subs includes all other GTRs, and oh how about the old school GTRs like the KPGC10? I know they're rare though.


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## Scrappy (Sep 22, 2003)

i think that the people who run this forum are to be commended for giving everyone a chance to vote and give an opinion on this. Welldone guys!  
I will admit though that since the new section merging went active i dont frequent the place as much as i did before cos i spend far to much time trying to find the threads im after whereas before i was able to find what i needed quickly and if i choose to go and have a look at the other model threads i could.


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## Mookistar (Feb 5, 2004)

kpkpkp said:


> I know I am going to get shot down for this but I dont think the poll is fair as the R35 owners are in such a minority that I think even if we all vote for the R35 section to go back to the way it was there are so many other R owners that we will just get lost in the ratios.


This is something quite important. Th poll is not a numerical vote. With the ratio of owners we have, like you say, the 35 will never win

what we want, more than anything, is input.

Skyline owners who vote, are doing so becasue they want to learn more about the new car. I imagine the vast majority don't care about the change and won't vote.

35 owners however have been most affected by the change, and if anything it's thier voice that needs to be heard.

if, at the end of the day, the majority of 35 owners vote one way or another, we will use that as the hand which guides us.

With respect to Guys post, i agree, the poll options are a little black and white BUT, it does potentially induce people into explaining thier choice.

There's nothing better than someone saying, "i don't like the change but..."

that input in invaluable.

what we want at the end of all this is an easy to naviagate, vibrant and well integrated community. how that comes together is up to you.

Mook


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## Mookistar (Feb 5, 2004)

Guy said:


> Perhaps you should have an R35 Moderator, who could be responsible for that section and also for ensuring that the R35 forums do not remain isolated (and no I'm not volunteering, I did my bit on here years ago!).
> 
> All IMHO of course!


Just to remind people, the moderator RobbieJ is an R35 owner.

Mook


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## Major_Sarcasm (Jul 28, 2004)

As a former 32GTR owner (soon to be again I hope), I have to say that I've always preferred reading about 32s to 34s. The 35 seems to share nothing mechanically with the previous 3 generations and as such, I can't see the 35 owners being interested particularly in the previous models and vice versa.

Personally, I click 'New Posts' whenever I visit and skim through the thread titles. The 35 stuff I tend to ignore as I'll never be able to afford one and don't want to upset myself  As a result, I'd be more interested in being able to 'switch off' certain parts of the forum so that I could click 'New Posts' and not get all the 35 threads intermingled with what I want to read.


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## David.Yu (Jun 28, 2001)

Well done Cem on asking for input so soon after the change.

Despite having owned an R32 and R33, I have to admit I preferred keeping the R35 chat separately. One seldom wants or needs to know about cars you used to own, or at least not as often as you want to be kept up to date on issues about your current car.

The thing about integrating events etc is very important though. Is it technically possible to replicate the events forums in two locations, i.e. have the events forum visible in the R35 section as well?


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## simplymo (Mar 25, 2006)

i liked it better before...but i think this is the way forward from a community point of view, all i can say is it does take time to get used too.

About visiting the forum more frequently or less frequently...i dont think re organising categories or sub categories should be a factor to a forum this "rich" with info...the search feature works quite well and if you want to scan all the new posts...do it when you have time! relaxing with a cuppa at the end of the day for example.


Give it time ppl...the "community" is more valuable than an extra 10min every now and then, we dont share the same tech with the 35's but we share the same heritage regardless if "they" like it or not...lol





and everybody needs to get to one of the meets and i'll personally show you how to integrate..."MINGLE"
:chairshot




my 2c...


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## ANDYR35 (Sep 1, 2008)

I am a new 35 owner but have always had a love for anything Skyline......you can't beat the noise from a well sorted RB!!

Personally i trawl through the whole site and post on things when i want to and enjoy dipping into the projects section to see what guys are doing with the Skylines.

However, when it comes to 35 general chit chat i would prefer to see it back to the old way, atleast then we can all bitch about our lack of warranty, chocolate gearboxes, thin paint and lack of jacks without pissing other people off and clogging up the Skyline chat area. 

Look forward to the new stuff when it goes live and to many happy years with my GTR!
:thumbsup:


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## speedyK (Mar 4, 2009)

Hats off to the mods for allowing this opportunity for all to give them feedback!

The old way was far easier – each was able to stay within the field of personal interest, but could view the other areas should they so wish.

From the votes so far, it looks right they were right to ask!


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## hodgie (Oct 23, 2003)

David.Yu said:


> The thing about integrating events etc is very important though. Is it technically possible to replicate the events forums in two locations, i.e. have the events forum visible in the R35 section as well?


I feel very sad that you`ve written that, i really do. This is the whole reason that we tried the change because we felt that new members weren`t using the forum to its full to find the other benefits.


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## kpkpkp (Dec 1, 2007)

Mookistar said:


> This is something quite important. Th poll is not a numerical vote. With the ratio of owners we have, like you say, the 35 will never win
> 
> what we want, more than anything, is input.
> 
> ...


Mook

Sorry mate I did not know that it was not a numeric poll and I think your points are very fair and it does raise the question is there another way to mingle.

Why not give each R32, R33, R34 and R35 car its own "Chat" area and then have a "General GTR Chat" area could comprise of all of the individual areas combined - so whilst you post in your own specific area at the same time it also appears in the General Section, that way we all get the best of everything. We can pin point what we want to look at when time is short but at the same time we can mingle when time and the mood takes us.

Kp


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## mindlessoath (Nov 30, 2007)

im interested in all the cars but they are very differnt in every respect and need to be seperated. to many people dont like to specify especially those who rarely goto forums if at all.

i also dont think that R35 people are not interested in the heritage. some are previous owners, some are huge fans of the past models, some wanted one but never had the want to buy or own an older car, let alone work on one... i belive that those who think that, are not full of themselfs but are not really getting it. they seem to want to be better, or they may not like change or something differnt.

the old skyline threads are massive and there are ALOT of threads and they keep going, its so hard to seperate them from anything R35 related, and searches are much harder than, cause search can use search in specific sections.

also on forums like nagtroc i like to use the "todays posts" or "new posts" and here at gtr.co.uk i cant use that, cause im not interested in all things skyline all the time. im really more interested in what i want to look at that day, the r35 stuff. not that skylines dont interest me, they do, but only when i want to read about them.


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## R8GTR (Jun 11, 2008)

speedyK is spot on - if you're current car is an R35 then for the most part you're visiting the forum to look at all things R35. On the occasions you've got the time you can always explore all things Skyline....simplicity is king!


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## simplymo (Mar 25, 2006)

R8GTR said:


> speedyK is spot on - if you're current car is an R35 then for the most part you're visiting the forum to look at all things R35. On the occasions you've got the time you can always explore all things Skyline....simplicity is king!





Hi...welcome to the forum

:wavey:



sry for the hijack...


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## walnuts (Mar 29, 2007)

David.Yu said:


> Is it technically possible to replicate the events forums in two locations, i.e. have the events forum visible in the R35 section as well?


Agree with Hodgie, this is a very sad attitude.

The onus is not on the forum to duplicate everything and prefix it with a "R35" just so owners will look at it. If 35 owners want to attend events and become part of the community, they need to look outside the confines of their little 35 section. The "Events" forums, etc are in their own section not in any 32,33,34 section that you may feel dirty going into.


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## Zed Ed (Oct 24, 2007)

Fuzzy Dunlop said:


> their little 35 section.


won't be long before the R35 represents the lions share of GTRs in the UK, and the forum will grow to reflect that

better the forum leads, than gets dragged that way


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## kpkpkp (Dec 1, 2007)

Dunlop I think that it is you attitude that is wrong. I like other R35 owners joined the forum for my R35. No sooner had I joined and got my R35 I came to the first meet I could. Met loads of the guys and had a great day out - infact I spent most of the meet pawing over a very sexy R32 (I dont like R32s or I didnt until I saw this one)

I love Skylines as do a lot of R35 owners but the issues is this - a lot of what gets asked by R32, R33 and R34 owners has been asked before or there is someone that is soooooooooooooo knowledgeable that they can answer a question, give good advice or give good direction. 

The R35 is very new and there is not such a large amount of very knowledgeable users (YET). When it is hard to find a an R35 thread as they are few and far between in the General Chat section then someone that might be able to offer advice may have missed it and therefore the community is not as effective. 

I know this place does not exist to service the R35 owners but to say we are not interested in other species outside our own little eco system is unfair and very generalistic.

Kp


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## David.Yu (Jun 28, 2001)

Fuzzy Dunlop said:


> Agree with Hodgie, this is a very sad attitude.
> 
> The onus is not on the forum to duplicate everything and prefix it with a "R35" just so owners will look at it. If 35 owners want to attend events and become part of the community, they need to look outside the confines of their little 35 section. The "Events" forums, etc are in their own section not in any 32,33,34 section that you may feel dirty going into.



When did you buy your first GT-R then? 

Are you aware that I co-founded gtr.co.uk back in 1995? You haven't even bothered to pay GTROC membership... 

As I said, I've had Skylines and I still love them, but the average R35 owner is going to want to primarily read threads about R35s surprisingly enough.

But if in "their little R35 section" there is an up to date section about events going on within the wider Skyline/GT-R community, why would that be a bad thing? Best way to encourage them to join in IMO.

If the consensus of this poll is that R35 owners prefer to have their own section, then surely what I suggested makes sense if the club wants to make sure as many R35 owners attend events as possible?


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## hodgie (Oct 23, 2003)

David.Yu said:


> :, then surely what I suggested makes sense if the club wants to make sure as many R35 owners attend events as possible?


It makes no sense at all, it just goes to show that certain individuals have no intention of looking further than one section, which you have clearly proved.
As i said before a very sad situation.


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## walnuts (Mar 29, 2007)

Sorry, deleted my own post then. 



David.Yu said:


> When did you buy your first GT-R then?
> 
> Are you aware that I co-founded gtr.co.uk back in 1995? You haven't even bothered to pay GTROC membership...


1999 to answer your question. I've owned 4. Been an OC member since almost day 1. When did you join the OC for the first time? Last year wasn't it? You may have started the website David, but you've had **** all to do with it's success and only posted twice here in 6 years until your resurgence with the 35, both times to promote your new website. lol


The point here is, the events sections are not in the "32,33,34 sections". So why should they be duplicated in the 35 section? If the rest of us can manage to find them, the 35 owners should be able to too.

I can understand the "threads getting lost" argument, but you can subscribe to threads so that they can be found easily.


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## Rattler (Jun 2, 2006)

neither here nor there


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## TrickyB (Apr 25, 2008)

hodgie said:


> As i said before a very sad situation.


The sad situation is a them and us attitude from a lot of people here.
R35 owners are not considered hardcore because they maybe havent owned a previous version and tuned it to 1000bhp.
What wrong with looking at one section if thats what interests me ?
How can that be sad ?


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## hodgie (Oct 23, 2003)

Its not about looking at one section that interests someone.



David.Yu said:


> Is it technically possible to replicate the events forums in two locations, i.e. have the events forum visible in the R35 section as well?


Which to me reads, i cant be bothered to search further than one section so can you post links for me.

Thats what i originally said was sad because all we where trying to do was get members new and old to integrate. Some have, some clearly wont.
Never did i go on about tuning a car or being "hardcore"


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## David.Yu (Jun 28, 2001)

Not at all sure why posting a suggestion (as requested by Cem in the original post) should trigger such hostility.

I am personally quite capable of finding the events section and have attended (and resurrected the threads regarding) some events myself.

I thought the desire was for more new members (newly joined R35 owners) to find those event threads easily and be tempted to attend too?
That was all my suggestion was intended to facilitate.

Next time, I'll keep my opinions to myself...


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## Blow Dog (Sep 4, 2001)

No suggestion should be met with any hostility. This would render this whole exercise pointless otherwise. 
Some excellent suggestions so far keep it up.


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## JapFreak786 (Aug 29, 2003)

combining them is great,but IMO,i don't really have much interest in the R35's,again this is completely my opinion,but a number of owner's worldwide seem to only have the car,as it's the car to "have" at a certain point in time....

i'll get my flame suit on,but you still can't beat the R32,R33,R34 heritage!!!!


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## mindlessoath (Nov 30, 2007)

i dont live in this area of the world, i dont care about events. same goes for many others. i dont see how you can make people search the events section, or even why you would want too. let them just be. you can make it easier by putting an event menu or post a forum wide sticky for every section u want to see the event or whatever it is.


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## gtrlux (Mar 8, 2006)

David.Yu said:


> Not at all sure why posting a suggestion (as requested by Cem in the original post) should trigger such hostility.
> 
> I am personally quite capable of finding the events section and have attended (and resurrected the threads regarding) some events myself.
> 
> ...


You are most welcome to post your opinion as Blowdog has suggested.

Neverless is there something you also not want to acknowledge, as most peeps ranting R35 vs old GTRs.

There are two mentalities that are not compatible with the idea of a forum composed by a respecting community of members with equal interests or at least with the courtesy to tolerate different interests groupes within the GTR scene:
1) The old or new Skyline or Skyline GTR owners, with no other clue of the scene other then about their own car or their mates car. Stuborn and unwilling to be interested in things that go out of their little world and disinterest for new things (R35 GTR) in the GTR scene . . . .
2) Old elitist pricks who think because they have been in the scene since the stone age, having owned all GTRs twice , that everyone who still has a flame of passion for a thing as simple as a standard R32, is automaticly a person descriped in point 1.!! New wealthy R35 owners missing the point that not so wealthy peeps can actually own a 600+HP GTR as well, despite not being able to afford even half of an R35. . . .that's the main reason the Skyline GTR isn't regarded as a japanese Porsche, but more as an upmarket Nissan, ex . . . .

I have allways expressed with enthusiasme and passion my admiration for the things I liked in the GTR scene, be it an old standard R32 GTR owned by a fat bloke in his little town in the anals of scotland or a full hardcore tuned R35 GTR from a Tokyo based tuner, driven through the wangan at 320kph.
We not need people who want to educate others about their experiences in the scene as much as we don't need an elitist R35 scene. We also not need old farts with their pub mentality or oil smelly garage people with their patchwork rusting GTRs, bashing everyone who is satisfied with the new set of bling 20" wheels on his R35.

That's my last two cents for the issue, as anyway I allways trust the mod team and Cem to make this place a great place . . . they have allways managed and they will allways do.:smokin:


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## chas (Sep 19, 2003)

I thought it was better the way is was before however, I've gotten used to the new format already, it just means I click through the forum in a different way. I'll go 32-34 first then whatever, and there's always the search button.
One thing I would say is that there must be only one Events and Meets section as these are for the whole GTROC and have never been car specific.

Charlie.


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## matt j (Oct 19, 2001)

I've been a member of the register from when Joss first ran it and its subsequent sale to Cem. Back then there were only a few R32’s and R33’s that anyone really knew about and knowledge was limited as tuners etc weren't even members; some of them hadn't even started out in business back then.

Times changed and the R34 was launched, the UK got 80 new cars and imported vehicles started to appear and new members joined, the register grew and adapted; still it wasn't too difficult to trawl through the new threads as you could leave it 24hours and come back to less than a page or 2 of new threads.

Recently, as to be expected, the register has grown yet again on an unparalleled level to before (and constantly grows through the efforts of Cem and the team) to a point where leaving the forum for 24hours means that you're coming back to a new post hit of 10 to 12 pages of threads. Now, this is where I personally experience some issues; if I select new posts I'm met with a lot of pages, I'm limited to logging on for 5 mins at a time as work allows and don't have time to read what I want to because I cannot personalise my ‘one button new posts search criteria’. I find myself initially checking user CP for threads I've subscribed to and prioritise them as first to read. Following that I have to search new posts to see what's going on in the rest of the forum.

Unfortunately, as often happens, I'll have to log off having only read a couple of pages searching for anything I think I'll be interested in reading. A further problem occurs when I then log in a couple of hours later as pressing new posts again brings up a whole new set of posts since my last logging on so I then have to search the relevant sections one by one or use the search function. I'm sure someone will have an idea about cookies etc but I just don't have the time to sift through 12 pages of threads looking for things of interest to me. No offence to anyone but I'd prefer to be able to read the relevant sections without trawling through the other Marques.

I think Cem is faced with a double edged sword here, we haven't always seen eye to eye yet I feel sorry for him in this instance; on one hand you want to keep a mixed community spirit and on the other you could force a splinter R35 forum into web. Again, personally my thoughts are to split the sections, possibly how Lux envisaged and have new post search buttons within each section. Then have a general chit-chat mingle area common to all.

I've had my R33 for over 10 years and have been here since the very early days (it's my second GT-R) but more recently I've had interest in the R35. I read threads here and went to Middlehurst's for a look and may even consider buying one, until then if I'm totally honest I just bypass anything related to them unless I'm wanting to learn something new about them. So in a way the mixing of the Marques isn't actually doing anything to bring the owners together as a community it's possibly having the reverse effect?

Not an easy decision for you Cem but I hope which ever way you decide to go it works out for you and the community you’ve helped develop.


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## clint thrust (Mar 20, 2008)

Change it back but put the meetings section in both areas.


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## Sub Boy (Jan 28, 2008)

I voted to return them back.

I did this as I think that most (not all) R35 owners seem to have no interest in GT-Rs....It's just a new sports car to them, Some also think that we have the "Crappy Old Model" cause we can afford one, If I wanted a R35 I would buy one....But I love my R32 and enjoy modifing it.


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## Mook (Mar 20, 2007)

Some great input so far.

Aside actual meets, what can we do to promote interaction online?

Every forum has it's characters, how can we encourage our users to mix online?

Mook


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## clint thrust (Mar 20, 2008)

Sub Boy said:


> I voted to return them back.
> 
> I did this as I think that most (not all) R35 owners seem to have no interest in GT-Rs....It's just a new sports car to them, Some also think that we have the "Crappy Old Model" cause we can afford one, If I wanted a R35 I would buy one....But I love my R32 and enjoy modifing it.


This why joining the forums is a bad idea.


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## paul__k (Dec 8, 2007)

I have voted to return to it to how it was primarily because it is more focused which is what a sub-section should be.

I find it offensive that


> (I only want to read about my own car)


 As have always been interested in the heritage having nearly bought an R34 some years back - got a Supra instead...

Paul


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## kpkpkp (Dec 1, 2007)

The way I see it is this . . . . .

Before the changes were made there were no complaints from the GTR R32, R33 and R34 owners regarding the R35 Chat being seperate. The R35 owners did not moan that they could not see the GTR R32, R33 and R34 section.

I think the poll speaks for itself but that said it would be good to have a "At The Bar" section for all general pub chat - there all people can walk in leaving their cars outside just like a real boozer . . . . . simples.

I would like to say thanks to Cem and the team for being so open minded about the siutation. I work for a large IT company that has a very strong forum and I have learnt a few lessons from this as has the rest of our admin team.

Many thanks

Kp


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## Mook (Mar 20, 2007)

Great point, defo time to rename "Non-skyline/gtr related chat"

mook


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## kpkpkp (Dec 1, 2007)

Mods - what do you think?

Do we have a Rename and mve of prominance for "At The Bar"

Kp


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## gtrlux (Mar 8, 2006)

Mook said:


> Aside actual meets, what can we do to promote interaction online?
> 
> Every forum has it's characters, how can we encourage our users to mix online?
> 
> Mook


The answers to this are:
GTR online dating and GTR one night stand seeker!  . . .a live strip wouldn't be bad as well . . . .


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## rblvjenkins (Mar 8, 2008)

I don't envy the mods who have to make a decision on this, but on balance I think we should revert to a separate R35 section.

My rationale? Simply that the typical forum user, of any forum, wants to get to new information about the subject they are most interested in as quickly as possible. Note that I say "most" interested in" not "solely" interested in. The fact that I am "most" interested in R35s does not mean that I have no interest in R32 - 34s, nor Stageas for that matter. In fact, up until joining this forum, I didn't even know what a Stagea was, and now I may well buy one in the future. 

So, why not give the typical user the ability to get to what they are most interested in as quickly and easily as possible, and give the option to access other information on other topics for when they have the time and the inclination to do so. Over time, I think they WILL do so, dipping into new sections and finding that they are indeed interested. However, trying to almost coerce them to do so, no matter how subtly, by combining too much information in a single place, will probably lead to less useage by everybody, simply because the "rich fix" that they were able to get to before has now gone. And here I'm talking not just about R35 owners who might dip into other sections, but also all the other users who might dip into the R35 section. It works both ways you know!

Finally, I must admit I do wonder whether the "us and them" attitude that some people seem to think exists between R35 owners and "the rest" really has any substance to it. I for one couldn't care less how rich someone is, what they do for a living, whether they choose to spend all their time building and re-building engines, what sex they are, how attractive they are, etc etc as long as they have a passion for their cars. Personally, I will probably end up modding my R35 to death over time, but that's just me. If you have a standard or highly tuned R32 or an R35 that you never want to change in any way, if you're on this forum, and perhaps more importantly if you come to events organised through this forum, I'm pretty sure you'll be the kind of person I want to associate with!


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## TrickyB (Apr 25, 2008)

rblvjenkins said:


> I for one couldn't care less how rich someone is, what they do for a living, whether they choose to spend all their time building and re-building engines, what sex they are, how attractive they are, etc etc as long as they have a passion for their cars. Personally, I will probably end up modding my R35 to death over time, but that's just me. If you have a standard or highly tuned R32 or an R35 that you never want to change in any way, if you're on this forum, and perhaps more importantly if you come to events organised through this forum, I'm pretty sure you'll be the kind of person I want to associate with!


I completely agree with this
Everyone on here is a petrolhead,Each new model will bring new members to the fold.They might not know the heritage or care to but they shouldnt be made to feel like they are not welcome.


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## sin (Dec 3, 2007)

Voted for separate R35 section. Did prefer it how it was tbh. 

Can totally understand why the mods want to integrate the community though. There is definately an us versus them vibe from some members of both communities.

Me, i joined the forum solely because i was getting an R35, and i wanted to find out as much info as i possibly could. Now that doesnt mean that i had never heard of GTRs before this or had no idea they even existed. It just means that at no point in my life i was never in a situation where i was going to purchase one. 

As a petrol head though and car fanatic, always admired and respected them from a distance. Seeing an R34 on the street still turns my head, and i do enjoy reading the build threads on 32s 33s & 34s, aswell as trawling through gallery and believe it or not i actually find these threads by pressing the appropriate icon on my screen because its something i want to read or look at, and i'm sure all new members are capable of doing this if its something they are interested in.

With regards to meeting and events, it doesnt help that some of them are only posted in the GTROC section. I understand the reasoning but not the logic. Members only track days, meets and events, contribute to the community and look what we have in store for you in the next 12 months. But some are hidden from general viewing, so some forum members will never ever see them and subsequently probably never join up fully. Just a thought.


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## cleethorpes (Sep 30, 2008)

one point I would make is the home page picture.....2 35's? doesn't really reflect what the majority of members actually drive...


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## Major_Sarcasm (Jul 28, 2004)

rblvjenkins said:


> I don't envy the mods who have to make a decision on this, but on balance I think we should revert to a separate R35 section.
> 
> My rationale? Simply that the typical forum user, of any forum, wants to get to new information about the subject they are most interested in as quickly as possible. Note that I say "most" interested in" not "solely" interested in. The fact that I am "most" interested in R35s does not mean that I have no interest in R32 - 34s, nor Stageas for that matter. In fact, up until joining this forum, I didn't even know what a Stagea was, and now I may well buy one in the future.
> 
> ...


Give that man a cookie. Exceptionally well put, sir.


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## kpkpkp (Dec 1, 2007)

I think that every member should be made to buy a the GTR book from the GTROC shop - it covers the history of the GTR from start to today and is probably the most in depth book I have ever read - if you are a true GTR fan then you should want to read this.

There is deffo a them and us feel to the forum from small amount of members on both sides but so what - you get that with football, F1, 911 and Caymen/boxster owners - we have all heard "I bought a Boxster because it is a good car not because I can't afford a 911". Who cares the point is we all own a GTR except the GTS GTT boys. 

Does it matter that you have been a fan from the first GTR or like me you only really knew about them from the R34 onwards or even more to the point becuase you just bought the lastest must have car - If you have only just discovered the GTR we should all finally be happy that your here. If your ownership experiance is only 4 months until you move onto the next must have then so be it - look at it this way I have had one night stands that have been just as enjoyable as long term relationships and I have often learnt something from the one night stand I would have never learnt from a long termer - so the hear today gone tomorrow peeps can still add value.

It is not about what version you drive, how much a fan you are or how long you have been a fan or how much money you have - I bet there are people on here that have spent more on their R3XXXX in upgrades than I have spent on just buying my car so your number after the R means the same as if you prefer Carling over Corona its a matter of taste and thats that. 

What it is about is right here, right now we are all hear because we all fans for one reason or another, we have all come to this URL to find and we just want to be able to find the stuff we're really into quickly and easily. 

Increase the peace!!!!:thumbsup:

Kp


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## simplymo (Mar 25, 2006)

kpkpkp said:


> I think that every member should be made to buy a the GTR book from the GTROC shop - it covers the history of the GTR from start to today and is probably the most in depth book I have ever read - if you are a true GTR fan then you should want to read this.
> 
> There is deffo a them and us feel to the forum from small amount of members on both sides but so what - you get that with football, F1, 911 and Caymen/boxster owners - we have all heard "I bought a Boxster because it is a good car not because I can't afford a 911". Who cares the point is we all own a GTR except the GTS GTT boys.
> 
> ...




i knew i liked you...:thumbsup:


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## obzi (Feb 19, 2008)

There must be a lot of new owners looking at this site with a view to joining and some people need to think about what they're posting.
There is absolutely no reason to insult, be aggressive or hostile when we're all here for the same reasons, we love these cars and just want an informative, fun to read site.

The site constantly needs need blood, it's better for everyone and if someones first look at the forum is an aggressive slagging off match we could lose them for good.

Or even worse, they might buy a Evo instead!


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## kpkpkp (Dec 1, 2007)

obzi said:


> Or even worse, they might buy a Evo instead!


So sometimes them and us is not a bad thing - Evo or Skyline - that is like Megan Fox or Patsy Palmer - there is only one worth having.


Kp


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## ramsub (Jan 8, 2008)

I voted to keep it separate but I do object to people thinking all R35 owners don't care about the other threads. I have drooled over the GTRs (all ot them) as a boy growing up in Australia and when I heard the R35 was coming I put down my deposit early. I am finally at a stage when I can afford the car and the upkeep and I do not think I should apologise for that. I also joined the GTROC club.

My main purpose of looking at the forums and posting threads or replying is to share information and experiences on the car I drive. It is as simple as that and why I would prefer the separate threads.

I do however admire the Mods for giving it a try and taking on board the comments even if some of them were not constructive.

cheers


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## hodgie (Oct 23, 2003)

I`ve voted to keep things as they now are. At the end of the day the section is "GTR Chit Chat" which i dont think many people are really taking much notice of. It seems that most of the members who want it back are more interested in the 35`s and strangley believe that they have lost part of their forum. 
Chit chat is what it says it is, all the techie sections are still there and will remain so.


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## kpkpkp (Dec 1, 2007)

hodgie said:


> It seems that most of the members who want it back are more interested in the 35`s and strangley believe that they have lost part of their forum.
> Chit chat is what it says it is, all the techie sections are still there and will remain so.


Hodgie

I hate to say it as you are a mod but to me you are one of the people that are fueling the "THEM" and "US" feel with comments like that.

Kp


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## CJay (Mar 23, 2008)

Blimey ....... I sometimes wonder why Im a car Nut 1st and a Biker 2nd 

Anyway Im sure we petrolheads will have harmony One day ....lol


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## hodgie (Oct 23, 2003)

kpkpkp said:


> Hodgie
> 
> I hate to say it as you are a mod but to me you are one of the people that are fueling the "THEM" and "US" feel with comments like that.
> 
> Kp


Im sorry you feel that way but i`ve never been on here and said that there is a them and us. Im a GTR fan simple, love them all, they are great cars all different but all GTR`s and thats why i see it as GTR chit chat.


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## kpkpkp (Dec 1, 2007)

Sorry mate - I feel bad now it is only because you keep refering to the R35 owners who think its their forum. I am with you, I love all things GTR and if the government had let us have company cars that were second hand and not taxed us on the new price I would have been a GTR owner years ago.

Funny my first non company car is a GTR anyway. 

Kp


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## hodgie (Oct 23, 2003)

kpkpkp said:


> Sorry mate - I feel bad now .
> 
> Kp


Don`t, we have to be different it what makes the forum interesting.
I read stupid amounts of this forum and have learnt how to make it work/find threads etc maybe thats why i find it harder than some to understand dislikes to changes. The ultimate priorty though is to have a happy community.


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## GBH (Aug 8, 2008)

I too have voted to revert back as i found it easy with the short amount of time i have to keep up with other R35 owners experiences and issues. thanks for giving us the opportunity to speak....


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## gtrlux (Mar 8, 2006)

kpkpkp said:


> Hodgie
> 
> I hate to say it as you are a mod but to me you are one of the people that are fueling the "THEM" and "US" feel with comments like that.
> 
> Kp


I disagree kp, hodgie isn't fueling anything and being one of the peeps that trawl the forum daily and have trowled it for a long time, he should (and I think he is) be capable to see that there is a clear gap of interest between certain users.

The stigma that all R35 GTR owner members are 100% disinterested in the old stuff, that made this forum what it is today, is wrong ! . . . as well as all old users having complete disinterest for the R35, is not true.

Neverless a good hand full of users want the forum to evolve in a direction where the R35 GTR is main focus. 
The R35 GTR scene is mainly composed by wealthy peeps and the howl R35 world, being it tuning, motorsports or lifestyle has a very "premium elitist" smell. This forum and most of the Skyline GTR owners are composed by individuals who run their cars on the edge of financing. Most have their bumpers attached with plastic wires to the chassis, as they can't afford a new one streight away. :chuckle:
But that's the true essence of the mid 90 GTR movement and doesn't match with Nismo R35 Sports package 8k dry carbon Recaro Seats.

I still stay by my old suggestion that the forum needs 4 or 5 separate sections for R32/33/34/35 and Skylines/Stageas . . .hell it even needs a separate classic Skyline section for the sake of the history of the car we want to talk about!

No GTR model should be treated with a special forum space. The only thing worth doing (that had been done very well) was to promote the evolution of the making of the R35 before it's launch in 2007. This was a very cool adventure and had it's climax when the first peeps could stand infront of an R35 in the Nissan Galleries in Japan end of 2007. Now please let the R35 take his seat as well.


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## matt j (Oct 19, 2001)

hodgie said:


> I read stupid amounts of this forum and have learnt how to make it work/find threads etc maybe thats why i find it harder than some to understand dislikes to changes. The ultimate priorty though is to have a happy community.


Ru raised a thread how the search facility here is poor at best, add that to a 'new posts' button and you're looking at trawling through page after page.

What you're saying is that your vast experience has enabled you to find ways of getting to the information you desire quickly, new members, most of which are likely to be R35 owners, don't have your experience and site knowlegde.

If you don't want to separate the forums, can you not consider making the search function better?


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## hodgie (Oct 23, 2003)

matt j said:


> Ru raised a thread how the search facility here is poor at best, add that to a 'new posts' button and you're looking at trawling through page after page.
> 
> What you're saying is that your vast experience has enabled you to find ways of getting to the information you desire quickly, new members, most of which are likely to be R35 owners, don't have your experience and site knowlegde.
> 
> If you don't want to separate the forums, can you not consider making the search function better?


I have to admit that the search function is far from perfect, type in your search word and you`ll probably find what you want on the 8th or 9th page. Most people would give up after the 2nd page.


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## kpkpkp (Dec 1, 2007)

gtrlux said:


> The R35 GTR scene is mainly composed by wealthy peeps and the howl R35 world, being it tuning, motorsports or lifestyle has a very "premium elitist" smell.


I feel that I am one of the people fighting the GTR owners corner. Am I wealthy, god no. Financed to the eye balls. Insurance paid for on my credit card and just about got the deposit toghether.

I had a choice, move to a new house or buy the GTR, after heaps of shouting matches with the wife she backed down and let me have my way. 

The car means everything to me and I should have waited to by a second hand one that was more affordable but I love the car so much and intend to keep it for a very long time and mod it when the warranty is over.

The R35 being owned by mainly by the rich is just not true. Check out how many people bought one on finance - there is a huge thread on it. I am sure there are some rich people that own one just like when the UK R34 came out - they were not cheap - damn agood R34 Vspec II is still best part of 30K hardly a cheap motor.

When I went to the Silverstone day there people in 10K scoobies to 130K 911 RSs. One of the things I love or loved about the GTR is it is a car that spans classes and was built for the petrol head. Clearly I was wrong.

Kp


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## David.Yu (Jun 28, 2001)

Yup, GT-Rs have never been cheap new. UK R34s were £54k 10 years ago!


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## kpkpkp (Dec 1, 2007)

Wow - I hope my R35 holds money like that but I very much doubt it.

Kp


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## tonigmr2 (Sep 12, 2002)

Now that's what I call a petrol head kpkpkp!!:runaway:

I thought it was a good trial, but sadly it's clear the majority of R35 owners want their own entire chat section. I suppose it is a completely different car from the ground up and they don't want to read about RBs.:nervous:


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## Stachi (Jan 26, 2008)

I voted 'Undecided'. Some time ago I said that I dislike the 35 section in General because of constant whining about warranty,delivery and Gearbox. I really like the 35 a lot, don't get me wrong, but simply can't afford one.

I think 'the 35 Guys' should have their own Sandbox to play, the car is much more different to it ancestors as the 32,33 and 34 are different to each other. At least they share the same engine.

I read in the 35 section sometimes, as I'm generally interested in the car itself. I'm sure some 'new' GTR Guys do read up some of the 'old rust bucket projects' with Interest too!

Marc


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## EvolutionVI (Sep 6, 2005)

Stachi said:


> I'm sure some 'new' GTR Guys do read up some of the 'old rust bucket projects' with Interest too!
> 
> Marc


We do,mate....as we need to fix our old rusty R35 buckets in 10 years too,we cant afford the next GTR´s,as the oilservices and tyres cost us arms and legs.....not to mention engines and gearboxes :chuckle:


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## Stachi (Jan 26, 2008)

You've got (and had) plenty of other Toys to have fun with 
I'll buy yours in 5 years, when I can afford it. So no need for you to deal with the rust 

Marc


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## TheDeadPrussian (Dec 8, 2008)

I have voted to revert back to a seperate R35 forum.

As has already been said many times by R35 owners, it is not that I don't have an interest in the earlier cars - I do, it is just that it was more easy for me to dip in and out when the threads were seperated.

I use a number of other forums, PistonHeads perhaps being a good example, where I use mainly the Porsche section for information and advice, but that doesn't stop me frequenting the other sections as well when I have the time or inclination.

I do believe in community and inclusiveness and the potential reversion to the old system won't stop me from visiting other parts of the site, but with an R35 coming soon, my interest lies mainly in the R35 at the moment.


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## obzi (Feb 19, 2008)

I'm not sure it's that 35 owners only want their own section because they're not interested in anything else, there's just a lot going off at the moment that's in no way relevant to the other cars.
It takes a while to search through the R35 stuff never mind everything else.

I see a time where it could be joined but the time isn't now, the poll clearly shows that.


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## Mookistar (Feb 5, 2004)

some brilliant input and opinions.

lets try to move on from the "us and them" thing though.

there is an us and them. us with Skylines, them with R35's

BUT, we've all made a decision to read about and enjoy our cars online. That alone indicates an enthusiast, and this is a Forum for all GTR enthusiasts.

I personally couldn't give two ****s about Mr "had a RS4 last year, got a GTR this year, buying a Z06 next year" He's not our tareget market and won't ever "get involved"

but theres a vast majority of 35 owners who ARE getting involved, even if it's only in the R35 sections, they are becoming active enthusiasts, and its from these seeds which the current Skyline generation grew.

So, us, them, it's all the same.

How can we get things "involved.

how can we get people to "share" thier love of these cars, in a way that allows them to enjoy what they've got, without being made to feel unwelcome or like they have wandered into the "slaughtered lamb"

and how do we ensure that the Skyline generation is drawn into the new car and find paralells with thier own RB series car.

Take Charles Charlie for example. He's true RB Skyline stock. Going through a car that designers have spent Billions developing and picking it apart to improve it. Take Linney, albeit for commercial gain, sourcing parts and mods which "improve" on the original design. These are the seeds from which the next generation of GTR Register members and GTROC members will grow.

How can we Share this journey?

mook


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## kpkpkp (Dec 1, 2007)

I think we are all sharing all be it some in small way and some in a big way. 

I would love to see a GTROC trackday, but with a twist. Find one with a nice (not expensive hotel) then we can bring the wifes - makes it less hastle and gets them involved, especially as they can then have a passenger lap round the track. One that is only open to the forum - I am sure we only need to get about 30 members in on it, maybe you already do one and that I have missed it. Also a day at the Santa Pod would be good.

A sticky in every forum section which is no more than a link to the "Meets" section as I am sure a lot of people miss it - some people browse the web in a very lazy manner, not a dig just a fact and these people need a few extra pointers.

You Skyline FAQ is also excellent - maybe all memebers should have it in their sigs as I am sure a lot of new members would see it and use it to ask the initial questions we all have.

How about a summer BBQ to mark the end of the summer - it is not too late and I am sure we could find a central location.

I know it is not for everyone but how about a GTR section at FOS next year - I am sure that Lord March would like something different.

Just a few ideas.

Kp


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## misters3 (Jun 23, 2008)

Mookistar said:


> I personally couldn't give two ****s about Mr "had a RS4 last year, got a GTR this year, buying a Z06 next year" He's not our tareget market and won't ever "get involved"


This kind of statement doesn't really sit well with the lets include everybody ethos that seems to be idea of merging the chat sections. (Although as an admin you set whatever tone you want on your site)

In my eyes, that's still an 'us' (hardcore will always own a skyline/GTR) and 'them' (those who are ridiculous enough to consider other cars) stance. 

What sort of commitment are you looking for? More than 1 year at a time?

And why wouldn't someone who sold on for an Z06 be made welcome? On the beemer and audi forums i frequent (as do some of the guys here), previous owners turn up to events / outings as those friendships are built on who people are, not what they drive exclusively. Also just because someone sells on a car, for whatever reason, doesn't mean they don't have valid input, and so should be made to feel welcome.



Mookistar said:


> How can we Share this journey?
> 
> mook


In my opinion (not an exhaustive list)
a) not worrying too much about duplicate threads from newbies (i.e no need to berate them for not using the search facility - remember those guys picking up their cars in Sept and that haven't seen this forum prior to the welcome pack in their cars, probably don't frequent the web as much as the rest of us)
b) not worrying about every single member having to be inclusive of the skyline family from day one. Build it - they will come.
c) Worrying about everybody understanding the heritage. I bought the book from the GTROC shop, yet i skipped straight to the R35 section. I will in time read the rest of it, but it's not my prime focus with an R35 arriving in 2 weeks time.
d) Understand that most of us have never tuned a car like the guys with R32/33/34's and until the R35 proves itself to be tunable without the GR6 going pop, most of us probably won't tune it that much. I for one don't have that sort of cash and more importantly time. Not saying i don't respect that guys who do tune their cars. 
e) Live and let live. Otherwise you'll lose the impetus of a new car and new members.

Just my humble opinion.


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## Mookistar (Feb 5, 2004)

perhaps i should rephrase that

I don't care for the sort of person that is only buying the new GTR to be able to say they've got the latest "big thing" and who's interest will wane after 6 months of ownership when something "better" comes along.

owning the car for any length of time and loving it is what its all about.

if you contribute and only keep the car for 6 months thats fine. What i don't want is people influencing the future of the forum when in actual fact they have little interest in its future

does that make more sense?

mook


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## TREG (May 20, 2004)

Mookistar said:


> does that make more sense?
> 
> mook




Beer please:thumbsup:


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## misters3 (Jun 23, 2008)

Mookistar said:


> perhaps i should rephrase that
> 
> I don't care for the sort of person that is only buying the new GTR to be able to say they've got the latest "big thing" and who's interest will wane after 6 months of ownership when something "better" comes along.
> 
> ...


Yes in that, I appreciate your clarification about loving any car for any length of time, but last part "What i don't want is people influencing the future of the forum when in actual fact they have little interest in its future" throws up another question. Would this vote have been better placed in the members area and maybe only open to those who have more than 1 years membership?

I'll be honest and say, I've voted but purely on a selfish basis of being able to dip in to R35 only stuff* quickly and easily (i'd even like an R35 gallery section!). Not on the basis of what is best for the future of the site. So on that basis maybe my vote shouldn't count. 

*FWIW l do read other parts of the site.


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## kpkpkp (Dec 1, 2007)

There is no question the time and need to merge the forum will come but I think the issue is when. It isnot yet IMHO. There are still too many unanswered questions and and events to pan out for the current and perspective owners. 

I think what makes the R35 part of the forum so valuble today is it is the only place in the UK can get find answers to a lot of the BS that is associated with the car. When a new user hits the forum for the first few times I woud say they are probably lurking, just trying to find out what's what. Their first post will be "Hello, do you know if ?".

It is only with time that they will start to explore the forum if they are new to the world of GTR. If they are not new then they will probably already be a member and have a lot more knowledge.

Kp


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

Merging the areas isn't the issue. It's people's laziness that causes issues. For example right now there are these thread in the *General Chat *area:

sky lines magazines wanted (should be in the wanted section)
Another vid I think you might enjoy... (should be in the gallery)
Parking sensors (should be in the R35 bodywork or R35 technical section)
Nice vid - Think you might enjoy (should be in the gallery)
rattle noise from gearbox ? (should be in technical or maintenance or....)

.... and the list goes on. I'm sure if people thought about where they posted rather than just using this area as the junkyard of the forum it would help considerably!


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## misters3 (Jun 23, 2008)

No offence John (or Mook) but if you read your posts and read the OP, it's not a clear and consistent message or at least not to me.

Integration will come from events, and once us R35 owners have had a chance to get to know our cars.

As for posting threads in the wrong place - if it's a common problem, maybe the layout/section needs to be looked at? i.e they aren't intuitive or easy to use for new (and even regular) users? 

PS - i say this as someone who has built a 2 forums from scratch, so i realise it's a PITA having people like me comment when you're doing a great job for free. But i'm only trying to be constructive. eg we have 4 mods (3 of whom are hardly on the site any more, due to kids/work etc) and 2 admins. I can't remember the last time i had to move a thread because the layout has been tailored to users.


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

I agree. Integration comes from face to face and people getting to know each other, but it starts with at least knowing something about the people and the cars. Many times over the years I have sought someone out to introduce myself and our conversation has been initially based on their car or things I have read about their car or some other 'event'. 

Perhaps if people are using this as a junkyard we should infract them or perhaps have everyone jump on the thread and call the dumpster out. Might not be to everyon'es taste but would be effective


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## Rich-GT (Apr 2, 2008)

Fuggles said:


> Merging the areas isn't the issue. It's people's laziness that causes issues.


OK, as a new R35 ownwer I have been through hating not having R35 chat, to living without it, however I think this is a very good point, and perhaps the biggest problem with the merged general chat has nothing to do with the integration but to do with the shere volume of posts in it?

Glancing through a couple of pages of recent posts I think *most* of them should not be in the general chat area!

Perhaps a better *experiment* would be to do away with combined general chat altogether?

Now can we have back the R35 General Chat... Please?


Rich


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## ScottyB (Jun 9, 2009)

Mookistar said:


> perhaps i should rephrase that
> 
> I don't care for the sort of person that is only buying the new GTR to be able to say they've got the latest "big thing" and who's interest will wane after 6 months of ownership when something "better" comes along.
> 
> ...


It makes absolute sense Mook,

My car is up for sale just now because i have been offered a very special car i missed out on last year and i would like to try and grab it if i can, if not i will be over the moon if i keep my GTR.

It is strange there are different levels of "Petrolhead" i am still best of friends with guys from the Subaru community from when i had my RB320, we still meet, i gate crash things in the GTR and it is all about still being part of their community even if i no longer drive a Subaru.

You get out what you put in.

I don't want to start a North South devide, however a lot of the meets and organisation seem to focus on down South which is fine as i am sure that is where the majority of the membership resides.

I have tried on a few occasions to make contact with Fuggles to discuss what we can do about a Regional Rep for Scotland to raise the profile and encourage members to get involved and have our own meets etc, i think there is a rep but see my point below, i have no clue who it is.

If the guys up North want to travel to meets they will, christ i have seen me drive all the way to London for a forum Christmas Party and it was brilliant.

A few things i have noticed which would really make a huge difference and have worked well elsewhere are the following.

New Member - When they join the forum (Not the club just yet) it is all about creating a good first impression.

Why can we not have an auto email going out to them introducing the key figure heads on the site, list the mods, reps etc with contact details and let them see the structure of the site/club from day 1.

I must admit i am still trying to work out who is who and i have been on here for months.

If people see structure and organisation with points of contact they are more likely to want to get involved.

A great example of this was the Asda Charity day - I was unable to attend as i am working away just now - I put a post up trying to get others who could not attend to dip into their pockets and donate regardless. We needed a figure head within the club to set up the facility to accept these donations and nothing happened, we had members willing to give their hard earned cash but nobody took the initative to jump on the idea and make it fly, sure it was last minute but even if it had raised a few hundred extra it would have been an excellent reflection on the members of the site. If i knew who had the "Authority" or know how to set this up via the club shop for example, or who had the membership standing to accept PAypal payments and pass it on we could have done something.

We don't want it being too regimental, i dont see the need for A Do's and Don'ts thread but a gentle introduction via email is a great start.

Secondly on the intigration issue, i would have no issues in getting together with other owners regardless what make of car they own. I recently met Vizi and his lads at the Scottish Street Car event after advertising it on here.

Again what i have seen work well is the facility when a new Event is posted and approved by mods that a PM goes out to all members to alert them, lets face it some people just don't read events sections. Sure this takes a small bit of admin but it works well and there are not that many events.

People then know about it and can make the arrangements to attend.

I hate the idea of a them and us, it will exist but it is down to all of us to help stamp it out, i love Skylines (and R35's...)  at the moment i spend most of my day looking at the R35 related sections but i often read posts on project R's in the other sections because that is my area of interest, big power engine set ups.

Final note and i have had long enough to try and find my way round all of the posts.

We need to tidy things up a little, Gtrlux's idea has some excellent merit. Especially on the technical side, this forum has a wealth of information which is difficult to find

GTR Register Main Forums:
- R35 GTR general chat
---- R35 GTR members gallery
---- R35 GTR tech forum
- R34 GTR general chat
---- R34 GTR members gallery
---- R34 GTR tech forum
- R33 GTR general chat
---- R33 GTR members gallery
---- R33 GTR tech forum
- R32 GTR general chat
---- R32 GTR members gallery
---- R32 GTR tech forum


Nissan Skyline and Stagea Forums:
- Skylines general chat
---- Skylines members gallery
---- Skylines tech forum
- Stagea general chat
---- Stagea members gallery
---- Stagea tech forum


Regards

ScottyB


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## obzi (Feb 19, 2008)

With a major site upgrade on the way is it not possible within that to give us the option of selecting what we want ourselves?
In other words an opt in or out option for each section so you can have them combined (like now) or separate (as before)?

That way everyone is happy.


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## Blow Dog (Sep 4, 2001)

Firstly, a big thanks to all who've posted. That's quite a statement actually as I asked in my post for reasons for your answers. That in itself is a community act 

You all might find this post a bit surprising actually. 

We have a moderator 'team' because I feel it makes decisions balanced and subjective. We don't actually always agree with each other and it's important every user on this forum knows that despite my odd comment, there IS a democracy on this site. I actually find myself disagreeing somewhat with the mods a little on this and I am perhaps the best suited to support the R35 corner more.

I don't own a GTR - I haven't owned one since 2004. Since then, I've owned a number of cars that are varied and diverse in brand and capability. I do seem to have settled in the Porsche's lately, so I kind of fit into Mook's generalisation:



> I don't care for the sort of person that is only buying the new GTR to be able to say they've got the latest "big thing" and who's interest will wane after 6 months of ownership when something "better" comes along.


He's gonna hate me for quoting that

Because basically, that person is every much the car enthusiast as the GTR owner who has been a loyal Nissan customer for 13 years. I have to admit, I'm not that person and I am more than happy to switch marques, brands, makes at the drop of a hat if the competition is making better cars. At the end of the day, I want my car to be the best in the class for fulfilling my requirements. If it is not, I'll get into what ever is at the time.

We ARE about the GTR. There's no question there. But it's also futile to ignore the vast differences between the R34 and R35. Even though leading up to the R34, shared DNA was massive, on the newer cars, they are totally different and as a result, we've attractive a different type of owner.

To ignore the wishes of these people would be naive and self destructive. They offer a perspective to communication and experience that is as yet alien to most loyal GTR owners.

However, it is also important to remember that the R35 and the community success it enjoys is directly a result of the existing owner base of previous GTR's in the UK and frankly goddamit, you guys need to bloody well come to more meets 

The voting looks pretty clear cut to be honest, I will be reverting back to how it was, but there does need to be a few changes too, not least about how the forums are split up.

Thanks again for all your input.


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## kpkpkp (Dec 1, 2007)

Without wanting to kiss arse - best post in the whole thread - I think you have summed up in one thread what many of us have been trying to say.

Maybe you should have posted that first and the we could have all agreed with you. 

Many thanks

Wicked Forum - Keep up the good work

May I add one final comment - As a member you should turn up to one meet a year and if you cannot make it you for go the right of membership. I appreciate you cannot just in force this but it may be worth looking at for all those renewing - it is not much too ask. I think you should also be able to bring you car to a meet even if you dont own a GTR any more (you will have to park in a Non GTR space) but as you rightly pointed out there are other cars that we may over look - I would have never bought my 997 C2S if my MD had not organised a test drive on my behalf and I nearly missed out on one of the best cars I have ever owned.


Kp


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## Mookistar (Feb 5, 2004)

Cem,

Glad to have ytou quote me mate. Like you say, the collective input from everyone is what will make this work.

mook


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## misters3 (Jun 23, 2008)

kpkpkp said:


> Without wanting to kiss arse - best post in the whole thread - I think you have summed up in one thread what many of us have been trying to say.
> 
> Maybe you should have posted that first and the we could have all agreed with you.
> 
> ...


+1 

Look forward to see what's coming next.


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## clint thrust (Mar 20, 2008)

kpkpkp said:


> May I add one final comment - As a member you should turn up to one meet a year and if you cannot make it you for go the right of membership.
> 
> Kp


You are kidding of course  . A condition of membership is you have to attend a meeting. No way will that stick.


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## Henry 145 (Jul 15, 2009)

My R35 which arrives in November from Westover is my first GTR and cannot wait...I have found this website and invaluable tool when researching the car...top marks for it Cem and team...I personally prefer the seperate part for the R35 as its easier for me to find the information on the car relevant to me.


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## Wildrover (Dec 16, 2008)

Cem & the Mod team

Also agree with your post above - well put. I think we all appreciate the fact that the mod team and yourself had the courage to revisit the issue and come to a democratic decision.

Now its up to us to make it work once you implement the revised forums - we don't have any excuses once this is done.

Personally, regarding meets, I used to attend these, but these days have lost some interest and won't be attending man (maybe because I'm now an old fart). 

Onwards & Upwards


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## Scrappy (Sep 22, 2003)

this is the only forum where ive actually seen this type of discussion and oppotunity to change things and i think its really good. A forum for the people by the people almost. It can only get better in that regard. Top comments admin and mods!  maybe you guys should run for government!


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## hodgie (Oct 23, 2003)

kpkpkp said:


> May I add one final comment - As a member you should turn up to one meet a year and if you cannot make it you for go the right of membership. I appreciate you cannot just in force this but it may be worth looking at for all those renewing - it is not much too ask.


Sorry but suggestions for the GTR Owners Club aren`t really relevent to this thread.


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## kpkpkp (Dec 1, 2007)

That's a shame Hodgie as my next suggestion was you had to attend all meets in a pink frilly dress with Dr Martins and a cowboy hat.:runaway:

Kp


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

I take it you've met :chuckle:


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## gtrlux (Mar 8, 2006)

OK here we go ,
Here is my personal wish of how this forum should look. Be it an inspiration and base for everyone to imagine his own perfect forum sections and may everyone come up with other ideas as well.

*GTR REGISTER FORUMS:*

*- GTR Register user guide / announcements / FAQ / rules:*
*- GTR Register user guide*
*- Announcements*
*- FAQ*
*- Forum rules*

*- Nissan Skyline GTR and Nissan GTR forums*
*- R35 GTR general chat*
---- R35 GTR members gallery
---- R35 GTR tech forum
------------- R35 GTR engine/mechanic tech
------------- R35 GTR body/interior/styling
*- R34 GTR general chat*
---- R34 GTR members gallery
---- R34 GTR tech forum
------------- R34 GTR engine/mechanic tech
------------- R34 GTR body/interior/styling
*- R33 GTR general chat*
---- R33 GTR members gallery
---- R33 GTR tech forum
------------- R33 GTR engine/mechanic tech
------------- R33 GTR body/interior/styling
*- R32 GTR general chat*
---- R32 GTR members gallery
---- R32 GTR tech forum
------------- R32 GTR engine/mechanic tech
------------- R32 GTR body/interior/styling

*-Nissan Skyline, Stagea & Classic Skyline Forums:*
*- Skylines general chat*
---- Skylines members gallery
---- Skylines tech forum
------------- Skylines engine/mechanic tech
------------- Skylines body/interior/styling
*- Stagea general chat*
---- Stagea members gallery
---- Stagea tech forum
------------- Stagea engine/mechanic tech
------------- Stagea body/interior/styling
*- Classic Skylines general chat*
---- Classic Skylines members gallery
---- Classic Skylines tech forum
------------- Classic Skylines engine/mechanic tech
------------- Classic Skylines body/interior/styling

*- Meetings and international chitchat section:*
*- Meetings & Events - UK*
*- Meetings & Events - Rest of World *
*
-Forum GTR Français *
*-Deutsches GTR Forum *

*- Non-related GTR chit chat section:*
*- Quality conversation forums*
---- Other cars and makes discussions
---- The gentlemen lounge
*- Entertainment forums*
---- Gaming Forum
---- Howsie Rant forum 
---- Porn Forum (wet, hard and loud)


After the traders and for sales sections as well as the club GTROC sections could　be kept as they are, whith the GTROC and Stagea club section being visible in one bloc.

For the "Announcement" Thread, a good idea would be to highlight it when ever a new announcement is made, for a week or so. 

The Non Related Gentlemen lounge is can old idea of my self where people with deeper interests an have apolitical, cultivated, respectfull discussions about very sensitive/important topics . .thought do you need a mod for that section alone.
The Other maques chat should also fall under the quality discussion, in order to get rid of people bashing without brain other cars or maques . . . respectfull and intelligent and constructive talk here.

The entertainment section would be more freestyle as it is for now.

Hope this can help the mod team, admin and Blowy to get things on track.

Regards

Chris

If porn section is possible I want to be a lifetime mod for there.opcorn:


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## _shaun_ (Jan 16, 2007)

I actually do like reading about all models but most of the time when I log on for a short period of time I just want to go to a certain section for updates etc and found it easier to get the information. Although it said "chit chat" there area lot of goof threads in there!


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## Snowfiend (Jul 11, 2006)

My 2p worth...

The re-separation of the General Chit-Chat will do nothing to help the 'them & us' issues or help the commuity intergrate. I tend to agree with what's been said before about chit chat areas being just that and people should use the sub forums better, however if that's what the R35 owners want then I say give it back to them...at least I won't have to trawl past R35 threads anymore 

Chris - Way too many sections for me personally. I mean do we need a Gallery for every type of GTR ?


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## IMS (Sep 18, 2002)

Snowfiend said:


> My 2p worth...
> 
> The re-separation of the General Chit-Chat will do nothing to help the 'them & us' issues or help the commuity intergrate. I tend to agree with what's been said before about chit chat areas being just that and people should use the sub forums better, however if that's what the R35 owners want then I say give it back to them...at least I won't have to trawl past R35 threads anymore
> 
> Chris - Way too many sections for me personally. I mean do we need a Gallery for every type of GTR ?


and as the engines in r32/r33/r34 GTR are, essentially, the same, splitting technical input seems over the top...what about GTS & GTT as well!!!


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## Zed Ed (Oct 24, 2007)

hmmm; my pennies

- seems like there is something for everyone in one part of the forum or another, irrespective of how it is structured
- I liked the previous set up, if only because it was easy to find R35 stuff
- am happy to dip into non-R35 stuff as and when

cool with whatever, but prefer as before


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## kpkpkp (Dec 1, 2007)

IMS said:


> and as the engines in r32/r33/r34 GTR are, essentially, the same, splitting technical input seems over the top...what about GTS & GTT as well!!!


The engines might be the same but I was under the impression that a lot of the everything was different even on the R34 GTR vs the GTS GTT - Mind you it was an R34 GTR owner that told me

I am sure I have read in the Skyline book that the GTRs were very different to the GTS GTT

Kp


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## [email protected] (May 19, 2006)

IMS said:


> Snowfiend said:
> 
> 
> > My 2p worth...
> ...


I have got to agree with this, I think the R32/R33/R34 technical sections should stay as they are. 

The cars are so similar that it wouldn't make any sense (to me at least) to split the information up when it could apply to any model. I would imagine there would be a lot of repetition this way & also make it a lot harder to find that information.

For instance the answer to my question about some part of the Rb26 may well be in the R34 section, but I have an R32 so if I only look there I could well miss it unless I also go hunting around all these different sections.

Though I'm fine with a separate technical section for the R35 because it is so different to the previous models, as to the general chit-chat Im not overly fussed. It was better for me the old way but I certainly don't mind it how it is now.

Edit: Just another thought, if we have multiple technical sections where will everyone put their 'best brakes', 'best pistons', 'best wheels', 'best conrods' etc threads!? :chuckle: :runaway::runaway:


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## 3G-Phone (Jun 1, 2006)

R35 threads are harder to find when they go cold for a while.


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## IMS (Sep 18, 2002)

kpkpkp said:


> The engines might be the same but I was under the impression that a lot of the everything was different even on the R34 GTR vs the GTS GTT - Mind you it was an R34 GTR owner that told me
> 
> I am sure I have read in the Skyline book that the GTRs were very different to the GTS GTT
> 
> Kp


I wasn't saying the engines were the same on GTS & GTT models, just pointing out that sections were called "R32 *GTR*" not just "R32 *Skyline*" in Chris' post and we should not forget there are a lot of knowedgeable GTS owners who should not be overlooked...we wouldn't ant to be looked at as elitest now would we:lamer:


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## kpkpkp (Dec 1, 2007)

Nor was I. My point was I didnt think the cars where that similar in terms of sharing components - I am no expert but I thought other than the chassis and the main car was very different. I do think all the sections should have their own Tech sections and bodywork sections but I do not think the gallery and the meets sections should be split - we are all one club/forum the Skyline GTR R number forum.

Kp


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## paul cawson (Jul 3, 2003)

Add R35 to the main discussion forum, but they also need there own general discussion forum in the R35 area as before.


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## Blow Dog (Sep 4, 2001)

Thanks all. I think it's obvious what needs to happen.
We'll revert back to the previous state as soon as possible.

Meanwhile, thanks for your efforts all. Much appreciated


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