# The cost of not declaring mods



## Tim (Jan 6, 2003)

Has anyone, or do they know anyone that has, had an insurance claim refused due to the insurance Co. finding undisclosed mods on a car after an accident ?
Just wondered if it ever happens or how hard they look to get out of a 50K claim.


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## Philip (Jan 17, 2002)

.


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## paul creed (Feb 18, 2003)

*I hope*

you havent dinged one of your beasts Tim!

Tell me your just curious!

regards..........Paul


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## Tim (Jan 6, 2003)

No, don't worry Paul, Just curious.


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## Project 400 (Sep 20, 2002)

Generally speaking undisclosed mods would make the policy voidable - however it is not yet void until they find out (or after a claim and find out).

Unfortunately it is also open to the company to pursue a criminal action against an individual for giving false details to obtain insurance (though the burden is for them to prove this beyond all reasonable doubt) and is unlikely to happen unless it i a massive claim where the mods had something to do with the claim or you caused a massive pile up.


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## Project 400 (Sep 20, 2002)

Oh yeah and they also do it if you are a persistent offender who drives whilst disqualified etc all the time. So mods tend to be low on the list unless they can prove you told them big and deliberate porkies like your is a genuine low mileage standard GTS - when it is in fact a crash damaged GTS with GTR engine up to 600BHP and Naaaawwwwws in the boot  and that you are not really 54 (21 real age) and Glenda is also not your real name


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## Peter (Jun 27, 2001)

Interesting one this as my insurers weren't interested in the detail of my mods, only the increase in the power of the car.... Of course, I always run my car at 0.2 bar on the road so where would that leave me if I had an accident?


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## Tim (Jan 6, 2003)

I'm a bit stuck with my current insurer as they're the only one that will offer me a "bonus match" on a second car but they want a full list of all mods. The policy will be ready for renewal before I've finished the list!!
I know some people just disclose the visible mods but obviously in the case of a refused claim you may as well just have third party cover.
Wonder if they'd notice that T88?


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## weka (Jul 3, 2001)

Tim

I had a claim on one my previous car as I declared it (my choice) written off but the policy did not covered the mods. I had them taken off and returned to stock condition ASAP before the insurance accessor came to have a look. Made two visits and each time thorough inspection. Asked whether it was modded in any way. Didn't find anything wrong and got the claim.


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## Project 400 (Sep 20, 2002)

If the insurers are only interested in the BHP/Power and you have given answer to the best of your belief then that is a bona fide contract made in good faith! No problems at all.

If they do ask for a full list then adding the extra item afterwards isn't gonna make any real difference to the mods and lets face it in the event of a claim and you have 20 listed mods to include the major bits nobody is going to start picking bones unless of course you intend to claim for everything on that list!

With some companies you can be a bit vague by saying Alloy wheel, body kit, suspension etc and they won't charge extra - but you keep yourself covered because you have declared all the mods. 

Furthermore I had light mods on my GTS when i wrote it off and nobody commented on the rims, coilovers etc. As long as the person taking that risk is willing to bite the bullet and not claim for the aftermarket parts as these would not be covered insurance, then the companies don't seem to be too concerned. 

Furthermore how many assessors out there know all the bits off these cars? And how many are gonna tear your engine to bits to find out what is inside? Especially with some of the stunners on this foum will theyreally spot HKS turbos? Hollinger boxes or 2.7 blocks - I doubt it!


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## Trevor (Jul 2, 2002)

Tim, 

An insurer wants to make money and mitigate against any risk as much as possible. They look at two main things when insuring your car for the road;

1) The cost of any total loss claim (hence market value, security features fitted, etc.).

2) The risk of insuring the individual on the said vehicle (age, driving history, location parked, mileage driven).

They will only insure your vehicle to a specific amount of cash (market rate for a vehicle of similar condition, age, miles, owners, etc.) and usually they will reduce this to as much as they can seem to get away with !

Now if you 'enhance' the vehicle to such an extent that the vehicle has had, say, 30% more money than its original value spent on it (in terms of what it would cost you to do the same to another vehicle) then you would NOT get this value back from the insurer in the event of any subsequent claim. This is true even if you inform them of the modifications! That's ofcourse _UNLESS_ you get a specialist bespoke insurance policy (more costly) with an "agreed value" element added as an amendment to the standard policy. (This costs extra).

o Insurers consider any modifications that don't add power, e.g. bodykits, wheels, stereo gear, tv's, dvd's, etc. fall into making the car more 'desirable' to a theif thus increase 'risk' to the policy therefore they must be disclosed. Normally they are not so bad on this issue because so many people had changed their stereo. Again, you usually won't get back the real value either* (sometimes this attitude varies for basic head units since aftermarket ones are usually cheaper than buying dealer's own original factory fit replacements!!!).

o Insurers consider any modifications that do add power in terms of % of power gained - this helps them assess risk of you driving it (they usually don't care what actual modifications where done because you won't get the money back for these anyway, as most insurers will only repair back to "standard" trim in the event of a claim). Just the very fact that you've "modified" your car adds a weighting bias to your premium, even if it was just a subtle rear spoiler.

Most insurers are very wary of agreeing a set value for the duration of the policy because they claim that a cars value can drop so significantly within the year of policy cover. They also take the stance that 'added aftermarket extras' will not significantly effect market resale value. In fact some actually go so far as to say they _decrease_ value of the car!

If i had spent a lot on modifications I would definately look at specialist bespoke car insurance with an 'agreed' value attached for both the car *and* the accessories.

Trev


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

*Suggestion*

If you want to continue this discussion you may wish to move it to the GTROC Members-only Bulletin Board.


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## KrazY_IvaN (Dec 30, 2002)

If your going to Mod you car I would always go for a Like for Like policy, yes it can be more expensive but it will be a "safe bet" in the long run. If you have an accident they will replace damaged part with the same part not the factory original, and always remember that an insurance company (Despite what they might say) are not allowed to right your car off with out your permission, you can turn down there cash offer for the car a demand that it is fixed to a pre-accident state.


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