# Lets be fair about Keiths banning



## leggus (Feb 15, 2006)

Cem, i see you closed the thread about Keith..

Is that what this forum is all about?

Silence people who disagree with your moderators?

Nobody on that thread was abusive or disagreeable, it was a debate about keith being banned, forum politics aside, Keiths input to a 'SKYLINE' forum (and this is what this predominantly is) was 100%..

I dont know Keith, i dont even know why you fell out with him.. but banning him because of internal politics stinks to be honest... theres been a lot of disagreement lately on this forum, but surely it can be sorted out without the heavy hand coming down..

Just my 2 p, and if i get banned for it, so be it.


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## MichaelG (Feb 21, 2002)

If i get banned also....then so be it.....

But my last post was branded ironic....

Yet i stated jason fuelled the fire, as i have sometimes admittedly done..

Yet when i do it, i am put in my place....when a mod does it.....the person its aimed at is banned....

see my point ?


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## C_h_a_z (May 8, 2004)

Do you reccon Keith would want to come back?


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## MichaelG (Feb 21, 2002)

This is the message Keith currently sees......How very 21st Century.....it was all more or less laid to rest as well until someone decided to start again. Unbelievable. 

Message as below:-
---------------------------------------
vBulletin Message 
You have been banned for the following reason:
No reason was specified.

Date the ban will be lifted: Never


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

MichaelG said:


> .....it was all more or less laid to rest as well until someone decided to start again. Unbelievable.


You mean like NOW?


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## leggus (Feb 15, 2006)

Its pi$$ easy to overide any website ban..... ive done it with a multi million dollar chat program.. but thats not the way forward, sorting out the internal problems is the answer


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## stuartstaples (Nov 14, 2004)

What a great shame. This can only be sorted out if both parties are willing to try otherwise it's just ****ing in the wind.


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## Hugh Keir (Jul 25, 2001)

I can remember being bullied at school; that was until I gave the bully a fat lip.

I see a few parallels here.

Maybe we should start another poll about bullying!


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## gtst lad (Mar 29, 2003)

MichaelG said:


> This is the message Keith currently sees......How very 21st Century.....it was all more or less laid to rest as well until someone decided to start again. Unbelievable.
> 
> Message as below:-
> ---------------------------------------
> ...


very sad , surely there was another way apart from a permanent ban? being a huge skyline/nissan fan i always thought of keith as being a big part of the uk scene.


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## MichaelG (Feb 21, 2002)

Fuggles said:


> You mean like NOW?


No John

Like the post thats been overlooked by admin.
you are not blind. nor stupid. 

Please dont act it.


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## Trev (Nov 1, 2003)

MichaelG said:


> This is the message Keith currently sees......How very 21st Century.....it was all more or less laid to rest as well until someone decided to start again. Unbelievable.
> 
> Message as below:-
> ---------------------------------------
> ...



Why a life ban? Surely theres been worse done/said on the forum?


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## m6beg (Apr 21, 2003)

To be quite Honest with everyone i think it Stinks  .
And me too if i get banned so what.

I too seen what happened at TOTB!! It happened in front of my car.

The Mods should grow up. Yea and that's me talking.

Its a Skyline forum. Shit happens.

I have taken a very dim view on a few people that i used to call my mates (Mods) For doing this to Keith.

Hell i know everything that Keith said isn't right. Or everything that he has done isn't right.

Everything i do isn't right.

There is a lot to be said regarding this matter. I for one want to know more. I am a paid up member and DEMAND to know more.

Mick


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## nismoman (Jul 13, 2004)

i see the other thread has been closed,will we be banned or told off for quistioning this .there are for more threads on here that should have been closed after 2 pages on the basis of THIS THREADS NOT GOING ANYWHERE but thay dont get closed.is this because it seemed to be going in keiths favour LISTEN TO YOUR USERS or are we all wrong or is it that some people cant see the wood for the trees????,ithink from were i,m sat things are interpritated to suit what the forum wants,this is a sure way to turn people away:wavey: NISMOMAN


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## stuartstaples (Nov 14, 2004)

Go Mick!!:thumbsup:


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## Trev (Nov 1, 2003)

Personaly speaking, I would like a full explanation as to why a LIFETIME ban is needed?

More to it than meets the eye methinks.......


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## MichaelG (Feb 21, 2002)

Believe me theres more. 

I couldnt give a shit anymore. 

Its censorship at its most extreme, and unexplainable backing of a moderator who as a clear personal grudge, and refuses to let it lie. 

Off to bed, had enough.


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## leggus (Feb 15, 2006)

So it seems from the above posts, the majority of the Skyline enthusiasts dont want Keith banned either... sort out your politics in PM mods.. keep this forums's knowlegeable users intact.. ive learned a lot from Keith's posts, as have many others no doubt. make friends FFS!!!


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## gtrlux (Mar 8, 2006)

i think that the paying members have a right to know about and of course the people involved, who are knowing the protagonists.
I am posting now and ask every body not involved, newbies an the ones like me, to avoid posting in here. 
That's why the other thread was closed.

Peace

Chris


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## nismoman (Jul 13, 2004)

this is getting people angre and to right ,like mick said yes keiths like us all ,we all have faults, if i remember there was a thread the other day ithink it was (i,ve just ordered a rb30) when a moderator came on and said something like yes we would like to know about your new engine SO LONG AS KEITH DOES,NT USE IT TO SELL HIM SELF AND HIS SPONSERS or something along thos lines.so who is causing the trouble will the moderator get banned .or are thay all whiter than white.:wavey: NISMOMAN


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## stealth (Jul 6, 2004)

What exactly was Keith banned for ?


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## gtst lad (Mar 29, 2003)

must say that its a shame keith got in so much trouble for telling us where he got his bits from, i can understand gtr.co.uk wanting to honour and protect its paying sponsors but surely it'd be better if this site earnt its money from google ads and the like and allowed all the uk skyline tuners and parts suppliers to be recomended by respected members that use the parts and the tuners themselves in an open manner where prospective customers can reply in an open forum.
Much better advert i'd say.

Sorry for ranting btw.


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## leggus (Feb 15, 2006)

stealth said:


> What exactly was Keith banned for ?


Who knows.. apparently he offered to meet O'Neale over some issue.


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## Blow Dog (Sep 4, 2001)

Firstly I don't understand half of what most of you are saying on this thread so I wonder how I assume to reply...

What part of my previous post did any of you misunderstand?
Why are the chief protaganists from the RB fold AGAIN!?

I quoted a post by Keith which went along the lines of:

"I'm going to physically hurt you next time we meet"

Well I'm sorry folks but spare me the preaching. I gave Keith AMPLE time to reply and I know for a fact he's read my question. He chose to ignore me AGAIN as he always does. I cannot sit back and have a user physically threaten a GTR Register Moderator, who looks after this forum in his free time for no payment, and then have to justify my reasons to a select group of scottish individuals who all miraculously use the same resources. If Jason had physically threatened Keith publically on this forum, then I'd have also asked him to step down. FFS if anyone knows I don't take sides, it's the bloody moderators.

Mick, you can demand all you like but I'm pretty amazed at your attitude considering our chats we used to have - you really do like to join the winning side don't you?

Like I said, this is not open to public debate. I've given my reasons and if Keith's unhappy with them, then I'll gladly discuss it offline with him, either on the phone or over email (an offer I've made before).

Cem


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## gtrlux (Mar 8, 2006)

edited . . . (".-)


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## leggus (Feb 15, 2006)

Its so shit its comes to this arguing bullshit.. no doubt this thread will be closed soon.. why cant everybody stop the f**k arguing over shit.... 

p.s. I'm not Scottish, just a GTR driver who looks for advice from all nationalities and friends on here.. removing them makes it a worst place to be


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## Asim R32GTR (Sep 24, 2003)

hey... I'm from Norway, i have never seen or met any of the involved... but still i have been on this forum for a long time.. and i just have to say that banning Keith is over the top.

No matter what he said, the mods should be professional enough to not fire up an argument, and then use the "power" to end things as they please.

Sorry if i go against the people who runs this forum, but my comment here is not meant to be offending to anyone... just my thoughts as a "outsider"....

Asim....


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

Despite what many people think I have no involvement with the forum in terms of what stays and what doesn't. Despite my lofty position :chuckle: I've even been rapped over the knuckles a few times - in private and in public. Whatever the case and there are always two sides to it and there has to be for it to be a disagreement. But, whatever, the reason there obviously were reasons and I doubt all of them are known to the forum at large. It's amazing what goes on behind the scenes.

That Keith has been banned is sad and unfortunate. That it has happened means something did happen and only after some long consideration and debate did it eventually come to this. I suspect it has been a slow burning fuse but that's just my opinion.

Whatever the reason, there were reasons. It's sad and unfortunate but no one individual or group of individuals are bigger or better than the forum as a whole with all it's members.

Just my 2p as a forum user like the rest of you guys (and gals)


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## gtrlux (Mar 8, 2006)

Fuggles said:


> Despite what many people think I have no involvement with the forum in terms of what stays and what doesn't. Despite my lofty position :chuckle: I've even been rapped over the knuckles a few times - in private and in public. Whatever the case and there are always two sides to it and there has to be for it to be a disagreement. But, whatever, the reason there obviously were reasons and I doubt all of them are known to the forum at large. It's amazing what goes on behind the scenes.
> 
> That Keith has been banned is sad and unfortunate. That it has happened means something did happen and only after some long consideration and debate did it eventually come to this. I suspect it has been a slow burning fuse but that's just my opinion.
> 
> ...



Agree full on that . . . . just not sure about your lofty position:chuckle:


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## leggus (Feb 15, 2006)

Asim R32GTR said:


> hey... I'm from Norway, i have never seen or met any of the involved... but still i have been on this forum for a long time.. and i just have to say that banning Keith is over the top.
> 
> No matter what he said, the mods should be professional enough to not fire up an argument, and then use the "power" to end things as they please.
> 
> ...


Seems the majority are against Mods banning people over personal issues... Keith posted many great threads on this forum, that the majority of GTR community enjoyed.. please Cem and Mods keep your internal politics away from the forum.. love him or hate him, Keith has contributed loads to this forum.. just look at the poll, lets keep this forum great  f*ck internal politics, lets discuss GTR's and how to make them better and quicker 

Thats why i came here, and so did many others


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

leggus said:


> lets discuss GTR's and how to make them better and quicker
> 
> Thats why i came here, and so did many others


:bowdown1:


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## stevenh (Oct 18, 2004)

leggus said:


> Seems the majority are against Mods banning people over personal issues... Keith posted many great threads on this forum, that the majority of GTR community enjoyed.. please Cem and Mods keep your internal politics away from the forum.. love him or hate him, Keith has contributed loads to this forum.. just look at the poll, lets keep this forum great  f*ck internal politics, lets discuss GTR's and how to make them better and quicker
> 
> Thats why i came here, and so did many others


also look at what keith has done for the gtr register team at totb, must tell you something.

he never deserved to get a ban.


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

True. But also look at his attitude towards the register for TOTB. This year, had he competed, he would not have cored any points for the register as he refused to be part of the team. It's not all good


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## stevenh (Oct 18, 2004)

true john but i dont blame keith for not wanting to be part of the team when certain people said in threads, he wouldn't be missed. sad really tho this forum used to be good, but week by week its just sliding downhill bigtime.


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

then it's up to EVERYONE to make a concerted effort not to let it continue as you say it is


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## R33_GTS-t (Apr 27, 2005)

Why has Keith been banned? What did he do at TOTB?


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

R33_GTS-t said:


> Why has Keith been banned? What did he do at TOTB?


See my earlier post:


Fuggles said:


> Despite what many people think I have no involvement with the forum in terms of what stays and what doesn't. Despite my lofty position :chuckle: I've even been rapped over the knuckles a few times - in private and in public. Whatever the case and there are always two sides to it and there has to be for it to be a disagreement. But, whatever, the reason there obviously were reasons and I doubt all of them are known to the forum at large. It's amazing what goes on behind the scenes.
> 
> That Keith has been banned is sad and unfortunate. That it has happened means something did happen and only after some long consideration and debate did it eventually come to this. I suspect it has been a slow burning fuse but that's just my opinion.
> 
> ...


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## leggus (Feb 15, 2006)

stevenh said:


> true john but i dont blame keith for not wanting to be part of the team when certain people said in threads, he wouldn't be missed. sad really tho this forum used to be good, but week by week its just sliding downhill bigtime.


Look.. i havent been here long, but for the time i have been here i have seen a great forum... its only this last few days its gone pear shaped..

This could be for a number of reasons, i know Cem has recently had a new arrival so probably is in need of a good kip!!

Lets get it back on track guys, sort this shit out with Keith, get Jason to un-ban him and lets get the forum back chatting about skylines


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## car killer (Oct 27, 2005)

i am fairly new on this forum, i have only had my gtr almost a year.
People may think why am i posting as i'm not even a paid member but these are the reasons i have not paid.
Banning keith off here is like banning GOD from church.
:bowdown1: KEITH IS THE SKYLINE GOD.:bowdown1: 



Blow Dog said:


> then have to justify my reasons to a select group of scottish individuals who all miraculously use the same resources.
> 
> Cem


Not sure it sounds very professional discriminating the scottish folk.If this was about Pakistanis it would be classed as racist.IMO


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

car killer said:


> KEITH IS THE SKYLINE GOD.


No he's not



car killer said:


> Not sure it sounds very professional discriminating the scottish folk.If this was about Pakistanis it would be classed as racist.IMO


Not at all the same, indeed some of those involved on both sides have been from various parts of the UK and elsewhere.


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## Blow Dog (Sep 4, 2001)

car killer said:


> i am fairly new on this forum, i have only had my gtr almost a year.
> People may think why am i posting as i'm not even a paid member but these are the reasons i have not paid.
> Banning keith off here is like banning GOD from church.
> :bowdown1: KEITH IS THE SKYLINE GOD.:bowdown1:
> ...


Should I laugh or cry at this?


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## Tigerbay (Mar 13, 2005)

opcorn: any one  

 Keith :banned:   please have him reinstated :wavey:


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## Taurine (Dec 13, 2005)

Hmm, over-reactions, arrogance and favourtism reign supreme around these ways. 

Way to go and do it the wrong way :clap:


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## stealth (Jul 6, 2004)

car killer said:


> i am fairly new on this forum, i have only had my gtr almost a year.
> People may think why am i posting as i'm not even a paid member but these are the reasons i have not paid.
> Banning keith off here is like banning GOD from church.
> :bowdown1: KEITH IS THE SKYLINE GOD.:bowdown1:
> ...


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## Mycroft (Apr 13, 2002)

I'll say it again, BEFORE any ban ask the protagonists to refrain from posting for a week or so.

Now in this case it appears [though I am not certain] that we have a long term poster that has put quite a bit into the forum and a mod.

The same applies, both need to consider 'being quiet' for a while.

I have found Jason O to be a reasonable mod here so he must have a bee in his bonnet, so it really is best that he dips out for a while and the same for Keith.

The forum is bigger than any individual, but it is the individuals [not the masses] that give a forum its character and it is character that attracts people.

The more 'characters' you have the more they will jostle for the breathing space.

No-one is a 'skyline god', but it has to be said that Keith has done so much for the promotion of the Skyline that he can't be dismissed as just another 'also ran'.

Now guys, the decision has been made and that is regrettable, genuinely regrettable as really all bans are to some extent an admission of failure on all sides.

There is a way to solve this, but it means compromise and I can tell you now, compromise is harder to swallow for some than, well, just about anything.

I personally consider Keith to be a huge advocate for the marque and if he can't be on here anymore I know that he will be welcome elsewhere and I can't help thinking it will be our loss here.

That's life, it is only the net... no-one died, no-one was crippled.

Get over it.


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## Hamish (Aug 3, 2001)

Blow Dog said:


> Should I laugh or cry at this?


You did make a totally unqualified insinuation that the reason people were backing Keith was that they were Scottish, a claim which has since been proved to be entirely inaccurate. You should know that it's not appropriate to make generalisations on people based on race/ nationality...


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## Chou (Apr 18, 2005)

Hamish said:


> You did make a totally unqualified insinuation that the reason people were backing Keith was that they were Scottish, a claim which has since been proved to be entirely inaccurate. You should know that it's not appropriate to make generalisations on people based on race/ nationality...


 Here we go again...


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## GTRJack (Aug 27, 2005)

This is really the big sh1t to be honest!  

Keith might have said something wrong or not, I don't know but before it got worst WHY NOT SIMPLE LOCK IT?! It's not that hard to see before the flame start...

Banning a member in my opinion is if the user continues to abuse the forum over and over despite several warning PLUS banning should add votes corresponded by other important members or moderators, administrator, NOT just tje choice by one moderator.

I'm not a fan of moderators abusing power, it's a bad name for the forum.

If Keith is banned heck I should've been banned a long time ago for hating yankies F-bodies :chuckle:


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## Tigerbay (Mar 13, 2005)

Faz Choudhury said:


> Here we go again...



Why the sarcastic look Faz ?? im puzzled


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## Blow Dog (Sep 4, 2001)

Sigh - I'm going to say this one more time and I will then lock this thread.

Keith posted this:



keith said:


> I will easy come and see you face to face Jason,then we will see who is brave.
> I know one thing for sure is that i dont need any back up to sort the likes of you out.
> 
> Keith


Oh and Hamish, I'm a little long in the tooth to be educated about what constitutes rasicm on a forum so spare me the lecture.


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## Blow Dog (Sep 4, 2001)

Mycroft said:


> There is a way to solve this, but it means compromise and I can tell you now, compromise is harder to swallow for some than, well, just about anything.


Absolutely 100% I agree with everything in your post. I am willing to discuss this with Keith and await his contact.


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