# M25 speed cameras



## smifffy (Oct 10, 2011)

Hi all,

I could be in for the shortest ownership of a GTR 

Went through an M25 speed camera earlier this week at above 100 leptons. Are these active all the time, or just when the speed limit is reduced from NSL?

Did a quick Google and there are many conflicting stories. Not sure anyone here will give me hard evidence, but at least make me feel a little better?


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## tonigmr2 (Sep 12, 2002)

Don't panic. You'll know within 14 days.:runaway:

Where they the average ones or just the gantries above the motorway? They're not always on if you mean the gantry ones. Did you see a flash?


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## manjit (Dec 17, 2009)

LOL Mate I dont think any of them are on, if so I'd be in HANDCUFFS :runaway::runaway::runaway:


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## MIKEGTR (Jul 8, 2005)

Depends where abouts. The ones by gatwick/heathrow area are on regardless of not being at a variable. The average ones on the dart ford bridge are on and so are the ones approaching from south to north. The new ones between jct27 and 28 aren't on yet and Id be surprised if the ones between jct 2 and 3 are on yet


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## smifffy (Oct 10, 2011)

I won't know within 14 days 'cos I haven't had my V5 through yet!

It was around the M4 junction. It wasn't a gantry, it was a concrete bridge before the gantry but it did have the speed camera markings on the road beneath. Didn't see a flash but I wasn't looking backwards and it was daylight


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## tonigmr2 (Sep 12, 2002)

Looking on the Pepipoo forums I haven't seen anyone complain of NIPs from any of the fixed bridges or gantries. It's all temporary speed limits and average speed cameras.


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## Nigel-Power (Dec 16, 2009)

Those cameras on the M25 don't flash I don't think. If it was by M4/Heathrow junction I would be a bit concerned. That part of the M25 is a hotspot, so more likely to have speed monitoring. 

but wait and see I suppose.


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## bobel (Jul 26, 2010)

Finally there is one perk of being Irish, we've Fu*k all camera here, all them around my area (3) have been burned out and not replaced and the few that are still functioning dont have film in them as apparently it's too expensive....gotta love the IMF.


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## MIKEGTR (Jul 8, 2005)

bobel;153892....gotta love the IMF.[/QUOTE said:


> Who also paid for the nice new roads too lol


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## bobel (Jul 26, 2010)

MIKEGTR said:


> Who also paid for the nice new roads too lol


Yep love the new Tarmac, they opened a brand new motorway on my door step last year with lovely new feeder roads.....its my patriotic duty to use them to their full potential....thank you my German overlords!:thumbsup:


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## MIKEGTR (Jul 8, 2005)

Lol I was there in July, lovely roads


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## AndyE14 (Mar 22, 2010)

Did your sat nav give you the camera warning? The sat nav seems to be pretty accurate in locating the real camera locations versus the fake ones (many of which also have the road markings). It is difficult sometimes to tell the difference between a flash from cams at night and from other cars headlights on less than even surfaces.

For what it is worth I was flashed by cameras when the signs were turned off a few years back on a stretch of the southern M25 and never heard anything back.

What is the position with the speed camera warning signs? As I understand it there has to be a clear warning sign but the M25 ones specifically refer to variable speed limits, could you not argue if the variable limit is not in force then the camera warning sign is not valid?


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## MIKEGTR (Jul 8, 2005)

The speed cameras are on the gantries and are sign posted. 

There are some fairly new ones that I'm not sure are on yet, but I doubt these even appear on sat navs yet


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## CT17 (Mar 25, 2011)

I can't believe you went fast enough...

I always seem to be stuck behind a transit in the outside lane, waiting for him to work out what lane coordination is.


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## smifffy (Oct 10, 2011)

Went back last night and had a slow drive through looking for cameras - I *think* there weren't any in the one I went through at warp speed. Oh well, we'll see!


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## PaulMcA (Feb 17, 2010)

I have used that stretch many, many times over the past 5-10 years. If the signs are not 'lit', so not showing a reduced speed limit, you'll be fine. 
In many different cars and when the conditions allow and at suitable times (late night or very early morning) I have gone through these far in excess of the NSL. So far, nothing to report  You'll be fine. :clap:


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## TrevF (Jul 15, 2011)

We have a stretch in the Midlands that uses variable speed limits, and as far as I am aware the cameras only go live when the speed reduction is in place, ie less than national speed limit!


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## ROG350Z (Jun 15, 2008)

Fingers crossed for you mate!


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## Robbie 733 (Feb 25, 2005)

Not wishing to be the harbinger of doom ..... but I've traveled that stretch of the M25 quite a bit, and have seen camera's flash for the odd fast moving vehicle coming in the opposite direction.

Can't say if the offending motorist ever received a fine, but they do go off.

I try to stick to 85 m.p.h or under when passing the gantries that have cameras on. :thumbsup:


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## OldBob (Oct 18, 2010)

I too have used that section quite a bit and on the odd occasion when you can go fast have definitely inadvertently driven faster than the NSL with no issue, but I couldn't attest to doing a ton up. As others have said mid 80's is usually the traffic flow speed through this section when capable for nearly all traffic in the outer lanes anyway.
Hope you don't get pulled smiffy and drive carefully in the conditions, but either way we'll all know within 14 days! pls don't forget to give us all an update.
It wouldn't be smart to poll on here but I bet you're not the only one to have inadvertently driven at this speed in a GTR or overtaken / accelerated to avoid a situation / accident etc mitigation ;-)
I too btw, with no real reason to believe other than hope, thought the cameras were only activated when the lights/posted speed were on.


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## enshiu (Aug 20, 2010)

How much tolerance is there on the motorway.

I see a lot people driving over 80 mph and I stick to 75 the whole time. 

M25 Southbound is every traffic sign above the road a camera?

I am not sure , just wait for your ticket.


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## Fmlad2002 (Aug 29, 2011)

CT17 said:


> I can't believe you went fast enough...
> 
> I always seem to be stuck behind a transit in the outside lane, waiting for him to work out what lane coordination is.


You and me alike - I always seem to be stuck in tons of traffic everytime im on the M25... I feel excited if i can reach 70 let alone go over it


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## C7 JFW (Jun 25, 2006)

The cameras have not been activated unless the sign above displays not just a number, but a circled number. A number with flashing yellows is advisory, a circled number is a limit.

When the circled number is displayed, there is an interim period of 30/60/90 seconds - or on some forums, up to 5 minutes - before that limit is actively enforced by the camera.


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## tonigmr2 (Sep 12, 2002)

enshiu said:


> How much tolerance is there on the motorway.
> 
> I see a lot people driving over 80 mph and I stick to 75 the whole time.
> 
> ...


APCO guidelines for ALL speed limits are: 
speed x 10% plus 2mph.

In other words in a 40 they prosecute over 46, a 50 at 57, a 60 at 68 and a 70 at 79.
(There are exceptions, some local areas try to prosecute at 'zero tolerance' levels, e.g. 33 in a 30 for instance).

Factor into this the majority of speedos overread by as much as 10% and you'll see doing an indicated 80 is in fact well within guidelines.

Going back to what I said earlier I'll be amazed if a NIP appears, usually if a camera is active you see people popping up on pepipoo complaining - and there are none regarding any fixed gantries on the M25 (lots of info saying they flash but never see a NIP though). Some possibility that new ones are digital and don't need a film changing though!


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## David.Yu (Jun 28, 2001)

C7 JFW said:


> The cameras have not been activated unless the sign above displays not just a number, but a circled number. A number with flashing yellows is advisory, a circled number is a limit.
> 
> When the circled number is displayed, there is an interim period of 30/60/90 seconds - or on some forums, up to 5 minutes - before that limit is actively enforced by the camera.


That may be the case practically if you have info that indicates that, but there are certainly cameras on gantries that function as enforcers for variable speed limits, but also can enforce the 70mph limit even when not lit up.


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## Jaw_F430 (Apr 14, 2009)

You should be fine, I was down that way prob 18 months ago and went through a few at a silly rate of knots. 

I did read somewhere that they do trigger if you go over 79mph even when they are not lit up though. Could be the luck of the draw though as to which ones are actually working. 

I now go through any now at ~75mph when not lit


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## anilj (Jan 30, 2010)

Hi Buddy, use that route daily and have done the same as you many times without penalty, but you need to keep it down when the motorway is relatively empty as the cameras dont have other traffic to conflict.

Just use the beast safely.....


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## mickv (May 27, 2009)

I've always understood that where cameras are enforcing variable speed limits they only operate when a circled speed limit is lit on the gantries. This is certainly how the new 4 lane Nottingham section of the M1 works, as I think I would have received a NIP by now if the y were always on.


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## Steve (Sep 21, 2001)

Just don't do it !!!

With reference to the "allowable" speed difference - it's 10% as you speedo isn't accurate !

Hence 77mph in a 70, 33 in a 30 etc, most motorways you can get awy with 85 ish but over the 100 is no, no. As for the that section I always obey the overheads !!


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## smifffy (Oct 10, 2011)

As an update to this: I haven't received any notification for the 'M25 incident' but I have just received a NIP for 84 in a 60 on the Hog's back in Surrey. Bloody dangerous this GT-R. Need to learn to moderate my speed....


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## CT17 (Mar 25, 2011)

smifffy said:


> As an update to this: I haven't received any notification for the 'M25 incident' but I have just received a NIP for 84 in a 60 on the Hog's back in Surrey. Bloody dangerous this GT-R. Need to learn to moderate my speed....


Get to a track day!


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## OldBob (Oct 18, 2010)

Thx for the update smiffy, was going to ask re M25. 
84 over hogs back easy to do...restraint definitely needed though.... Was it a follow job or camera or what?


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## enshiu (Aug 20, 2010)

smifffy said:


> As an update to this: I haven't received any notification for the 'M25 incident' but I have just received a NIP for 84 in a 60 on the Hog's back in Surrey. Bloody dangerous this GT-R. Need to learn to moderate my speed....


My custom SATNAV (laptop) has never indicated over 79 on the M roads and A roads with separation. So wherever you are look on your MFD. 
The rest of the road I drive zero tolerance. 

Ticket magnet these GT-R's on the road.


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## smifffy (Oct 10, 2011)

It was a mobile scamera van. Thought I'd seen it well in advance of the area it'd be clocking people at and was feeling very smug with my observant driving, but obviously not. Must have been a very long lens on that thing.

The scooby that was blasting past me at the time must be well in the deep brown stuff by now.


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## Gary_GTR_R35 (Jul 29, 2011)

smifffy said:


> Went through an M25 speed camera earlier this week at above 100 leptons. Are these active all the time, or just when the speed limit is reduced from NSL?


Smiffy - when I attended my drivers awareness course last year (opted for a good brain washing instead of the points), the advanced police driver that took the course did state the following. M25 speed limit is 70mph, if you are lucky to not be in traffic, most police officers will not pull you over for safely driving up to 80mph. But this is not official. He then went on to say that the camera's are only active ONCE the speed reduction warnings are enabled.

2 other interesting points to think about:

1) the awareness class was with 21 participants with myself as the only bloke and 20 women - Who says women are better drivers?? :chuckle:

2) suggest in the future you need to be driving around the 175-185mph speed so that the camera does not catch you... :banned:


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## PaulMcA (Feb 17, 2010)

Thanks fo the update. And as way of update I have used the M25 several times over the recent 4 week period and when empty and safe to do so have cruised at very 'respectable' speeds. Still no overhead camera been set off or NIP in the postbox. :smokin:


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## enshiu (Aug 20, 2010)

enough sneaky cameras or non marked police cars on the M25 not going to try it. They do not work when the speed display is off.


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## Gary_GTR_R35 (Jul 29, 2011)

Smiffy - all my points that I have today come from the police scamra vans.
The get you from long distances and they dont appear to worry about the 10% over the speed limit niceties... . 

Seal up the letterbox if it cant be delivered then you can recieve the points, alternativly put your head in the sand and hope it goes away! :chuckle:

Good luck fella..


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## dinny (Sep 21, 2011)

dont come to cork or you will meet the mobile speed vans and the un-marked garda cars who have plenty of film


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## tonigmr2 (Sep 12, 2002)

smifffy said:


> It was a mobile scamera van. Thought I'd seen it well in advance of the area it'd be clocking people at and was feeling very smug with my observant driving, but obviously not. Must have been a very long lens on that thing.
> 
> The scooby that was blasting past me at the time must be well in the deep brown stuff by now.


If they've offered you a NIP and 3 points I'd bite their hands off at 84 in a 60, that's well into 6 point territory! Of course, you are within your rights to ask for a photo to 'help identify the driver'.


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## Anders_R35 (Jul 20, 2011)

Do the camera vans only operate in the day, presume night vision would be useless with car headlights?

Anders


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## smifffy (Oct 10, 2011)

Yep - I'm accepting the 3 point offer. 

No idea about night-work for these scameras?


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## David.Yu (Jun 28, 2001)

Yup, both fixed and van based cameras can work at night. You don't think they'd lose more than half the working day to catch people in winter, do you?


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## enshiu (Aug 20, 2010)

Those vans camera work on infrared at night I assume?


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## Mookistar (Feb 5, 2004)

Is there a way of getting a conclusive answer on the M25 cameras. My brother went through them last week at, erm, a little over the limit, and knows they don't flash. There was no illuminated limit but do they have a preset trigger over, say, 120 :nervous:

Mook


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## Anders_R35 (Jul 20, 2011)

David.Yu said:


> Yup, both fixed and van based cameras can work at night. You don't think they'd lose more than half the working day to catch people in winter, do you?


In 12 years driving in the UK, I've never seen a van on a bridge at night. The reflectors on the side of the van would make it visible IMO.

Edited to add, I'm talking about speed vans on unlit sections of motorway.

Anders


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## Anders_R35 (Jul 20, 2011)

sorgsam said:


> Well written article, I really appreciate, thank you for sharing, I will always come after the site and look forward to more and better stuff you have posted.


Well spammed, your four other posts have the exact same BS statement. Mods kill this waster!


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## MIKEGTR (Jul 8, 2005)

Mookistar said:


> Is there a way of getting a conclusive answer on the M25 cameras. My brother went through them last week at, erm, a little over the limit, and knows they don't flash. There was no illuminated limit but do they have a preset trigger over, say, 120 :nervous:
> 
> Mook


If its the essex stretch then I wouldn't worry just yet, they are new and there also aren't any speed camera warning signs on the Gantree yet, which I believe makes it entrapment.


Here's a question to those who may know (not you Enishu) But do all speed cameras have to be painted yellow by law now??? As obviously the M25 ones aren't and nor are they positioned on a painted pole? Could this be a potential loophole (afterall they are safety cameras and not speed cameras and are meant to deter not catch - according to the goverment PR)


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## Adamantium (Jun 24, 2002)

I went on one of those speed awareness courses yesterday and was surprised that despite there being something like 80% fewer cars on the road between 11pm and 6am, that time period still accounts for 40% of accidents!


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## MIKEGTR (Jul 8, 2005)

Adamantium said:


> I went on one of those speed awareness courses yesterday and was surprised that despite there being something like 80% fewer cars on the road between 11pm and 6am, that time period still accounts for 40% of accidents!


And how many of them are on our safest roads and how many involve drunk drivers coming home from the pub and drunk pedestrians etc. Don't be fooled by spin - Motorways remain our safest roads, despite the fact that speed suposidly kills


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## TAZZMAXX (Mar 9, 2010)

Anders_R35 said:


> Well spammed, your four other posts have the exact same BS statement. Mods kill this waster!


Killed as requested. Ooh that felt good!


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## Anders_R35 (Jul 20, 2011)

TAZZMAXX said:


> Killed as requested. Ooh that felt good!


You got a .50 Cal key on your keyboard


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## MIKEGTR (Jul 8, 2005)

enshiu said:


> They do not work when the speed display is off.



Clearly another example of u talking out your arse. I've just seen with my own eyes a camera on a gantry flash someone on the opposite carriageway and when I turned round to look at the gantry there was no speed limit indicated. This was around the heatheow area of the m25. 

I'd estimate that these are probably set for 85ish mph (I didn't see how quick the car getting flashed was going) but these cameras clearly do work even when the signs are off. 

Another example of why u shouldn't listen to a word enushui says!!!!


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## R35Audio (Jul 9, 2002)

MIKEGTR said:


> Clearly another example of u talking out your arse. I've just seen with my own eyes a camera on a gantry flash someone on the opposite carriageway and when I turned round to look at the gantry there was no speed limit indicated. This was around the heatheow area of the m25.
> 
> I'd estimate that these are probably set for 85ish mph (I didn't see how quick the car getting flashed was going) but these cameras clearly do work even when the signs are off.
> 
> Another example of why u shouldn't listen to a word enushui says!!!!


I can back that up also. I got flashed on the M6 around Birmingham where the fixed gantry variable signs are. There was no speed limit being displayed but it flashed at me doing around 85 leptons. In fact it flashed at the BMW in front of me I was following first, then me. Didn't get a ticket however


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## No_GT-R_Noob1 (Mar 21, 2012)

Hi there, I'm new to your forum.
I was searching for info regarding the M25 gantry cameras and found your site.

Last night, I was travelling along the M25 anticlockwise inbetween the M40 and M4. It was about 11PM at night with very littte traffic on the road. None of the variable speed limits were lit up at all (all blank). 
I was in lane 3 when I was double flashed by an over head gantry camera about 2-3 miles before the junction with the M4. I was doing about 95mph.Now i'm bricking it, :runaway:
I thought I should register on here and tell my tale as nobody on here has actually been flashed by the gantry cams when the variable limits were not in use. I'll update If I get any news.


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## GTRDan (Feb 1, 2006)

As far as im aware, they are illegal because you cant see the camera and there not painted. weather thats true or not, i dont know.
What i do know is, ive been flashed loads of times, and never had a ticket.


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## MIKEGTR (Jul 8, 2005)

GTRDan said:


> As far as im aware, they are illegal because you cant see the camera and there not painted. weather thats true or not, i dont know.
> What i do know is, ive been flashed loads of times, and never had a ticket.


I asked that also, but not sure if it's a legal requirement to have them visible as there is a speed camera sign on the gantry, so I presume entrapment wouldn't wash but maybe thrown out on a technicality. 

On the plus side the variable stretches will be the first to get the 80mph speed limit, not that it makes any difference


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## Zed Ed (Oct 24, 2007)

I mostly behaved myself a couple of fridays ago on the new widened stretch, anti clockwise between M1 and M40, as I'd noticed cameras going in on the new gantries.

Cunningly as I arrived at the M40 junction, there was a camera van on the bridge.

I'm in the clear after tomorrow; reckon he was dialed at 85.


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## MIKEGTR (Jul 8, 2005)

Zed Ed said:


> Cunningly as I arrived at the M40 junction, there was a camera van on the bridge.
> 
> I'm in the clear after tomorrow; reckon he was dialed at 85.


There purely for safety's sake and not to make money!


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## GTRDan (Feb 1, 2006)

Im 100% sure fixed speed cameras have to be visable, which is why they are all painted yellow, that law come in to force years ago. ASSUMING that aplies to all roads everywhere ie m25, then they have to be illegal, because you cant see them. But we all know what assumtions make!!!


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## FLYNN (Oct 6, 2006)

MIKEGTR said:


> There purely for safety's sake and not to make money!


*They're :thumbsup:



GTRDan said:


> Im 100% sure fixed speed cameras have to be visable, which is why they are all painted yellow, that law come in to force years ago. ASSUMING that aplies to all roads everywhere ie m25, then they have to be illegal, because you cant see them. But we all know what assumtions make!!!


The cameras on the M25 are to enforce speed restrictions and are not like the "accident black-spot" cameras, which do indeed, have to be painted yellow. Also, bare in mind that the M25 cameras were installed before the new legislation was introduced.

A road where a speed camera has been place has to have had a fatality on it, although it doesn't have to be traffic related. Crafty buggers.

Mobile vans have to display a "camera" sign on them, problem is, by the time you've seen it, they've got you.


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## MIKEGTR (Jul 8, 2005)

FLYNN said:


> *They're :thumbsup:
> 
> 
> 
> .


Stop stalking me u prick. And no I meant what I wrote, THERE purely to make money


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## FLYNN (Oct 6, 2006)

MIKEGTR said:


> Stop stalking me u prick. And no I meant what I wrote, THERE purely to make money


Woah. Why so mad dude. There was a smiley at the end of it. Only a joke. Jeeeez. Don't go telling the mods on me. 

_Note the correct use of "there"  roflcopter_


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## OldBob (Oct 18, 2010)

No_GT-R_Noob1 said:


> Hi there, I'm new to your forum.
> I was searching for info regarding the M25 gantry cameras and found your site.
> 
> Last night, I was travelling along the M25 anticlockwise inbetween the M40 and M4. It was about 11PM at night with very littte traffic on the road. None of the variable speed limits were lit up at all (all blank).
> ...


Be real interested to know if you get done noob. From the other carriageway I've seen those exact cameras go off a couple of times now recently and the b*stards are making me slow down for them now ;-)
Wouldn't want any state Nanny thinking these poxy things actually work...


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