# 2860-5 turbos disappointing dyno run



## GOGS 2 (Jun 21, 2009)

Hi i just had 2860-5 turbos fitted and a remap done on my power Fc done today and the power figures seem a bit low compared to other people results

On 1 bar it made 430hp fly 341 whp and at 1.2 bar 477 fly and 388 whp the car feel rapid makes full boost at 4.5k

But I was hoping for about 500hp seen other dyno runs with 2860-5 getting 500hp at 1 bar and about 540hp at 1.2 bar?

Any idea on the low results or is it just different dyno giving varied results?


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## Sub Boy (Jan 28, 2008)

I needed more than 1.2 bar to make 512hp at the wheels on my -5s, I think it was more like 22psi, but it does sound a little low.
Have you got enough injectors/fuel/AFMs? Do you have adjustable cam gears?


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## RSVFOUR (May 1, 2006)

The dyno can make a diffeerence.
Its difficult to say what power you should make without the spec but as said before it does sound a bit low . 
Mind you 5s can run 1.5 bar easily enough


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## GOGS 2 (Jun 21, 2009)

580cc injectors are at 80% it's only making 388hp at the wheels at 1.2 bar I was hoping for 500hp at the fly. It was the coil packs preventing any more boost


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## rob wild (Jul 30, 2007)

Where was it mapped and which dyno?


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## FRRACER (Jun 23, 2013)

Reminds me of this

http://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/250993-disappointing-day-dyno.html


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## robGTRr32 (Nov 1, 2014)

This is a very interesting read for me. 

I had precisely the same issue as the OP when I upgraded to 2860-5's earlier this year, and I was similarly disappointed. The car as it stands feels plenty fast enough, but I expected more. Despite some further investigation, including changing the 20 year old coil packs (!), the output didn't improve.

My car was set up and mapped at Eurospec 2000 in Guildford. I don't know for sure but I have read somewhere that their dyno reads on the low side, but surely not enough to explain the differences here. 

I am going to have the car remapped shortly by a different specialist to see if that makes any difference and will take it from there.


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## FRRACER (Jun 23, 2013)

Buster had the same issue disappointed with the GTSS and I had a passenger ride in the car and felt like a slug. We fitted -5 and he took the car to Greg at Protuner and the car came back transformed. The car is an animal now!


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## GOGS 2 (Jun 21, 2009)

It was mapped at Wallace performance there dyno is known for giving low figures but I still expected more than 477hp fly on -5 at 1.2 bar

I had a look at the turbos when I first got them and the part no was defiantly the 2860-5 part no

A few years ago I got the timing belt changed at Ellon car clinic and they made quite a few **** ups on my car.

I am now wondering if the cam timing is slightly off could this be the cause of a big loss in power?


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## FRRACER (Jun 23, 2013)

Nothing wrong with the turbos mate.

What cams have you got?

Maybe list your engine spec and supporting mods so we can have a better idea .


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## GOGS 2 (Jun 21, 2009)

Standard engine head cams etc. apexi ecu, greddy boost controller, hks exhaust and decat,xs power down pipes, r34 turbo elbows, standard exhaust manifold ported to gasket, 580cc injectors, tomei fuel pump, nismo fuel pressure regulator, standard airbox


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## CSB (Nov 15, 2007)

I'm hoping for at least 600 at the fly. I'd be sad if I don't get it


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## UKPAISLEY (Jan 17, 2003)

You are running about the same spec as me.
I have 420 at the hubs, so about 450BHP @ 1.2 Bar.
I have mine mapped on 95 Ron with conservative ignition, and that's about all that can be had. If I run at say 1.4 Bar I can expect to take this to about 500 ish I expect. If you are on V-Power fuel things can be pushed a little harder close to 550. 
If the engine is forged the limit can be pushed again to the 600 Mark.

I am going for closed loop knock control to push the ignition further while still making things safe using an upgraded ECU.


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## git-r (Nov 15, 2005)

I get 473 @ hubs with just under 1.3 bar boost on mine... (540 ish at fly)

Seems pretty low for the amount of boost.

it is pretty disappointing, with different turbos and 440 at the hubs on the same dyno mine did the 1/4 in 11 secs at 125mph.


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## GOGS 2 (Jun 21, 2009)

It's running on v power and the guy that mapped my car is decent enough. I am beginning to think that my cam timing is off slightly as the guys that changed my timing belt where a bunch of idiots


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## UKPAISLEY (Jan 17, 2003)

Torque wise you are a little bit less then my GTR, I think I have 5 or so more , so if you are on V power you have a little more to get if needed. The cam alignment will make a big difference too. I think you can squeeze another 40 odd out of it without more issue. After that increase the boost. The sweet spot for the-5's is about 1.4Bar.


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## UKPAISLEY (Jan 17, 2003)

I am assuming you can measure the airflow or you have dumped the MAF's


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## GOGS 2 (Jun 21, 2009)

Still got the standard mafs the guy tuning it reckoned. he could still map it if the mafs maxed out


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## dazman (Mar 9, 2007)

GOGS 2 said:


> Still got the standard mafs the guy tuning it reckoned. he could still map it if the mafs maxed out


As far as im aware you will need nismo afms or go mafless.I was getting 517BHP ATW - 426lbft of Torque before I had my engine forged, but had apexi filters, tomei cams type A ,Tomei cam gears and 1.2mm head gasket aswell as all the other mods.


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## UKPAISLEY (Jan 17, 2003)

You can map past the MAF's , but its not the best to be honest. So to recap you are maxed out until you change the MAF's or ECU


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## GOGS 2 (Jun 21, 2009)

I was hoping to get 500hp on fairly low boost and didn't see the point changing the mafs if I could get that power on the standard ones


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## scoooby slayer (Jun 13, 2009)

git-r said:


> I get 473 @ hubs with just under 1.3 bar boost on mine... (540 ish at fly)
> 
> Seems pretty low for the amount of boost.
> 
> it is pretty disappointing, with different turbos and 440 at the hubs on the same dyno mine did the 1/4 in 11 secs at 125mph.



that's spot on imo 125 mph indicates about 550 hp r32 gtr, quick car, some will say that is 650 hp lmao :runaway:


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## scoooby slayer (Jun 13, 2009)

GOGS 2 said:


> I was hoping to get 500hp on fairly low boost and didn't see the point changing the mafs if I could get that power on the standard ones


my mafs maxed out at 440 hp which is about 410 hubs, all this 70 hp transmission loss is nonsense imo more like 30hp on a dynapack all just imo and ime


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## UnderDriven (Jul 9, 2015)

You really need to upgrade the MAF's.


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## GOGS 2 (Jun 21, 2009)

Well I am getting 388whp at 1.2 bar so something isn't right with my car


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## GOGS 2 (Jun 21, 2009)

If the guys that changed the timing belt had put the belt back on a tooth out on one of cam pulleys or both could this cause this sort of power loss?


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## UKPAISLEY (Jan 17, 2003)

Yip


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## UnderDriven (Jul 9, 2015)

It would but I think you would notice if it were off. Always good to double check


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## scoooby slayer (Jun 13, 2009)

GOGS 2 said:


> If the guys that changed the timing belt had put the belt back on a tooth out on one of cam pulleys or both could this cause this sort of power loss?



It can make a big difference, my skoda octavia felt noticeably quicker after I did the Cambelt on it, the only thing that could of been wrong was a tooth out.


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## GOGS 2 (Jun 21, 2009)

Okay thanks I am pretty sure I know what is wrong with my car then. The guys that changed my gtr timing belt have got a habit of ****ing things up.


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## GT-R David (Mar 13, 2013)

UnderDriven said:


> You really need to upgrade the MAF's.


x2
You can't get more power with the stock MAF's


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## RSVFOUR (May 1, 2006)

GOGS 2 said:


> Okay thanks I am pretty sure I know what is wrong with my car then. The guys that changed my gtr timing belt have got a habit of ****ing things up.



why take it there in the first place


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## git-r (Nov 15, 2005)

scoooby slayer said:


> that's spot on imo 125 mph indicates about 550 hp r32 gtr, quick car, some will say that is 650 hp lmao :runaway:


Thanks mate  

It was 440 @ the hubs when it did the 11 at 125mph.. abbey think it's about 70 to get fly power so 510 ish.. It'd probably go a bit quicker now with 470 @hubs


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## GOGS 2 (Jun 21, 2009)

I went to that garage because my timing belt was away to snap I took the cam cover off to check the belt and it was ****ed it had cracks on it. Previous owner told me it had been changed

I phoned all the local garage and no one was willing to change the belt apart from one place the guy that owned the place he owned a gtst and they had a lot of Japanese cars there and where ment to jap car specialists

They cracked the top pipe of the radiator. The belt was noisey when I got it back from them so I got them to check the belt tension. When I got it back again the cas sensor was wobbling like **** they snapped the drive on the end of cam for the cas sensor

So I wouldn't be very surprised if they have got the timing wrong on the belt
They also managed to **** up my friends 1.4 focus

I don't really see the point spending £600+ on mafs I don't need for power level I am trying to get when the mapper can tune past the max voltage on them


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## GT-R David (Mar 13, 2013)

I'm sure it will be a great tune then.
Will match the quality of the timing belt change perfectly.
I'm out...


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## GOGS 2 (Jun 21, 2009)

It was wallace performance that was doing the mapping. Not the retards at Ellon car clinic


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## FRRACER (Jun 23, 2013)

GOGS 2 said:


> I went to that garage because my timing belt was away to snap I took the cam cover off to check the belt and it was ****ed it had cracks on it. Previous owner told me it had been changed
> 
> I phoned all the local garage and no one was willing to change the belt apart from one place the guy that owned the place he owned a gtst and they had a lot of Japanese cars there and where ment to jap car specialists
> 
> ...


Glorified mechanics turned tuner overnight. You got to be really careful who your trust your car with because get it wrong and potential for massive bill!


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## AlexJ (Apr 3, 2003)

GOGS 2 said:


> I don't really see the point spending £600+ on mafs I don't need for power level I am trying to get when the mapper can tune past the max voltage on them


£50-100 will get you a pair RB20/S1 RB25 MAFs which will handle 600BHP - the PFC will support those MAFs.


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## UnderDriven (Jul 9, 2015)

GOGS 2 said:


> the mapper can tune past the max voltage on them


:runaway:


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## GOGS 2 (Jun 21, 2009)

Finally got my car running properly got a set of tomei type a cams fitted and ignition timing set up correctly 

Cars now making 470hp at 1 bar instead of 430hp and it's now making 506hp at 1.1 bar before it only made 477hp at 1.2 bar

I think the ignition timing being badly of was probably the main reason for the low power before


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## Ray-GTR (Jun 17, 2017)

GOG 2 what supporting mods have you got to get that power?.


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## GOGS 2 (Jun 21, 2009)

Nismo mafs full exhaust system down pipes decat etc 580cc injectors tomeI fuel pump nismo fpr apexi ecu greddy boost controller 

Tomei type a cams but I reckon you could get similar power with standard cams


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## Ray-GTR (Jun 17, 2017)

GOGS 2 said:


> Nismo mafs full exhaust system down pipes decat etc 550cc injectors tomeI fuel pump nismo fpr apexi ecu greddy boost controller
> 
> Tomei type a cams but I reckon you could get similar power with standard cams


Cheers mate. I already have a pair of 2860-5s, 720 denso injectors, Blitz Nur spec r Cat back exhaust, HKS pod filter and a hard pipe kit to install, RB25 MAFs. Might get upgraded fuel pump and oil pump and with the spec of the engine from the PIC I should be good to go. Just need an ECU and boost controller also.


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## GOGS 2 (Jun 21, 2009)

All you really need is a ecu and boost controller and fuel pump

I think swapping the oil pump is a engine out job standard one should be okay if you don't rev the car over 7.5k


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## Ray-GTR (Jun 17, 2017)

GOGS 2, You mentioned you get full boost at 4500. At what rev range do you start getting positive boost on your -5 setup?


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## GOGS 2 (Jun 21, 2009)

I think my car is making about 0.5-0.7 bar at about 2.5-3k rpm

I reckon it starts making boost about 2k


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## Ray-GTR (Jun 17, 2017)

GOGS 2 said:


> I think my car is making about 0.5-0.7 bar at about 2.5-3k rpm



cheers mate. Think I am going the -5 route..


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