# HELP NEEDED - URGENT! NISSAN RIP OFF!



## GTRmallorca (Dec 8, 2010)

Hi guys,

Well, I just got the fright of my life. 

Started getting weird noises from transmission, car seemed to brake in 1st and Reverse at full lock, so sent car to Nissan for 30K service and to find out what the problem was.... and SURPRISE SURPRISE they call me today to say that the car has been driven short distances with VDC off so the guarantee does NOT cover the new transmission. 

I thought this issue had been solved by Nissan issuing a new version of their warranty booklet stating that the car could be used with traction control off!! I have driven the car twice on a circuit!! Have every service in the book, 28,000km and 1.5years old from new!!

PLEASE HELP ME GUYS! ITS ALL IN HANDS OF MY LAWYERS BUT I NEED INSIDE KNOWLEDGE!


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## alloy (Apr 29, 2005)

This was the info the forum posted up http://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/125950-gtr-warranty-oil-temperature-notification.html


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## Aerodramatics (Feb 10, 2008)

Hi GTRMallorca.

That's a stressful situation; plus economically very scary at first worry. :runaway::

Relax. Stay calm. Remember: You are not at fault. You have no case to answer, Nissan do. Warranty or no warranty, under EU law the product must be fit for the purpose it was described for and free from defects. :smokin:

First thing I'd say is remember gearboxes can be repaired, even the GR6 for our GT-Rs and there are aftermarket specialists out there who supply and fit repairs for sensible money, i.e. a few thousand Euros rather than tens of thousands of Euros. In the UK, I beleive Car Planet Racing, Severn Valley Motorsport, Litchfield Imports can all do this. I also think I read GTC stock a full range of GR6 upgraded parts. :thumbsup:

A sticking solenoid is a common first fault for the box and can be economically repaired, if I recall correctly. So fingers crossed it's something simple. 

If I were you I'd let Nissan diagnose the fault and offer you a price for repair. Then you can consider your aftermarket options and your option to have it repaired (upgraded!!! :chuckle at an aftermarket specialist to limit costs. You also may have an option to sue Nissan for the cost of repair, if they are fault due to a manufacturing defect, provided that's a legal option, but you'd need to consider if you were likely to win with your solicitor and also be prepared to prove you have a case and spend the time and effort necessary to win it. :banned:

A first step might be reminding Nissan of their revised policy as per Alloy's link above, i.e.:

"There is no specific risk of mechanical failure from driving with ESP off and there is no intention to reject a warranty claim based on the ESP setting. There has never been a warranty claim rejected in Europe due to this and Nissan has no intention of doing so in the future."

Not a pleasant place to be, but you do have options to convince Nissan to uphold their policy or alternatively to repair it economically yourself and try to recover your costs, none of which need you paying for a brand new GR6 transmission yourself. You have my sincere sympathy but also best wishes, I'm sure there's a way to solve it without too much expense or hassle. Nissan may yet come good. Fingers crossed and have faith. :wavey:


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

That you have stated it is in the hands of your lawyers means the GTROC is unable to help


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## Aerodramatics (Feb 10, 2008)

Another option is to offer to pause legal action and seek mediation with Nissan, if they agree.

It seems a simple matter of either the policy is upheld when an ESP-off claim is made or it is not.

However, if an owner's caused damage to a transmission through genuine abuse, Nissan would be in their rights to refuse repair under warranty. 

Are Nissan saying ESP-off with no evidence meets their standard of evidence for abuse?
+ is the failure diagnosed consistent with ESP-off, given "Mechanical failure encountered while driving with ESP Off is covered by warranty" according to Nissan's own policy clarification.


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

Just to explain; "VDC off" *is* covered by the warranty and there are cases in the past where there have been issues and there has never been a problem whether or not the VDC is on or off. However, when you take your car in they can tell by looking through the Flicker (data recorder) whether the car was being abused at the time or whether there has been abuse previously and for any length of time. Any manufacturer will void any warranty if it can be proven the car has been abused and the fault is as a result of such incidents. There are other (non-Nissan) forums with similar examples so it's not just Nissan.

Anyway, as I said previously, it is with your lawyers so suggest you continue with them and I hope this information is helfpul in some way. But, because it is subject to due legal process (and because you're not a GTROC member) we wont be getting involved.


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## christer (Jul 16, 2010)

I think the term "abuse" is way to ambiguous to be honest. If taking the car on track is "abuse" then a lot of people would not have purchased one. Doing endless donuts (if even possible) in a car park somewhere I guess is closer to the mark? I am constantly looking for Nissan to show some signs of reversing the negative wave of feeling towards them and I haven't found anything in this thread - although the OP may well have been "abusing" his car I guess - it is just a shame that everything seem so "uphill" with Nissan and the dealers unfortunately....imho, dyor.


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

christer said:


> I think the term "abuse" is way to ambiguous to be honest. .....


From a legal dictionary:
a·buse (-byz)
tr.v. a·bused, a·bus·ing, a·bus·es
1. To use wrongly or improperly; misuse.
2. To hurt or injure by maltreatment
n. (-bys)
1. Improper use or handling; misuse.
2. Physical maltreatment.
4. An unjust or wrongful practice.


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## christer (Jul 16, 2010)

Fuggles said:


> From a legal dictionary:
> a·buse (-byz)
> tr.v. a·bused, a·bus·ing, a·bus·es
> 1. To use wrongly or improperly; misuse.
> ...


As I said, it is too ambiguous but thanks for the "definition". How this is applied to the use of a very high performance track focussed vehicle's traction control is where the difficulty lies - not the use of Google...imho, dyor


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## alloy (Apr 29, 2005)

It's even more ambiguous when you factor in the marketing campaign and the ring time/saga. I'm certain, although happy to be corrected, the video of the lap you could see VDC was off, would Nissan abuse their very own GTR?


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## GTRmallorca (Dec 8, 2010)

Thank you very much all for your quick responses.

First of all I would like to make clear that I have only ever launched the car twice, and have only been driving with the ESP off for the last 6 months only, twice on track for about 4 laps of 1.36mins...keeping below the 120ºC temp for tranny

I have never revved the car whilst cold, ever, always above normal operating temperatures. 

I have done all the Nissan services.

They are saying that the data logged shows me driving the car for short periods of time with the ESP off. The reason for this is that I live 5 mins drive away from work and on a bloody Island for christs sake! 

I have discussed this with my lawyer, but havent taken any action yet. I wanted to get more info from here and ask my nissan dealership for a full mechanical report. 

Do you guys have a copy of the new warranty manual that confirms the changes mentioned in the earlier post? I need to send this to Nissan and my lawyer! 

Thanks a million everyone! I feel more reassured with your posts!


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## sumo69 (Mar 31, 2008)

A spirited drive along normal roads can never be considered abuse - I would suggest you ask the HPC to refer to Nissan Europe to be reminded about the "amended" warranty wording.

D


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## GTRmallorca (Dec 8, 2010)

sumo69 said:


> A spirited drive along normal roads can never be considered abuse - I would suggest you ask the HPC to refer to Nissan Europe to be reminded about the "amended" warranty wording.
> 
> D


I have! I´ve sent them a nasty letter demanding a full explanation and mechanical report, and I have sent them the amended warranty wording mentioned on the post. :squintdan


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## Litchfield (Feb 26, 2008)

If you need any help or advice with your gearbox if Nissan can't provide warranty cover just let us know 

Regards

Iain


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## GTRSTAR (Nov 26, 2009)

What a shame that Nissan dont offer standard warranty on the gearbox for earlier model years.

Nissan should either recall all gear boxes and fix common weaknesses or honour a warranty that covers the gearbox whatever mode is used.

It's very sad that Nissan don't stand behind the GTRs weaknesses as much as they do it's strengths.


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## MidLifeCrisis (Apr 29, 2011)

If turning off VCD voids the warranty, why give us the switch to do it in the first place I ask??

Might as well label it "Warranty no longer Required" switch.

Got to have if stuck in snow, OK, let it automatically engage again after xx seconds / minutes.


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## Marky_GTSt (Dec 31, 2005)

MidLifeCrisis said:


> If turning off VCD voids the warranty, why give us the switch to do it in the first place I ask??


I was just about to ask the very same question.....

Surely that fact alone means they have to honor the warranty ?


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## Fuggles (Jul 3, 2001)

MidLifeCrisis said:


> If turning off VCD voids the warranty, why give us the switch to do it in the first place I ask?


It does not void warranty as has been explained previously herer and in other threads to some considerable detail


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## MidLifeCrisis (Apr 29, 2011)

Fuggles said:


> It does not void warranty as has been explained previously herer and in other threads to some considerable detail


GTRmallorca is being told it has rendered his warranty void, or that is being used as the excuse to refuse a warranty claim. I sincerely hope your are correct Fuggles and it's "dealer error".


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## christer (Jul 16, 2010)

MidLifeCrisis said:


> If turning off VCD voids the warranty, why give us the switch to do it in the first place I ask??
> 
> Might as well label it "Warranty no longer Required" switch.
> 
> Got to have if stuck in snow, OK, let it automatically engage again after xx seconds / minutes.


+1 - very little that Nissan say or do relating to the GTR makes any sense.


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## GTRmallorca (Dec 8, 2010)

Fuggles said:


> It does not void warranty as has been explained previously herer and in other threads to some considerable detail


I have been reading all about the problem since the GTR was released in the US in 08. I was very aware of the "weak" transmission so I made sure never to launch the car (except the obligated once) and was always very careful with all of the temperatures. 

Nissan Europe are claiming that the car has been driven for short periods of time, aggressively and with the traction control on OFF. Damned right I have.!! I live on a small island where the longest possible drive is 40 minutes! All of my drives are short and yes, I find the R mode too bloody intrusive so I switch it off. I think I have the right to do so after having spent 90,000€ on a bloody sports car.

Anyway, after having sent the nasty letter to my Nissan dealer in Barcelona threatening legal action and laying out my discontent as to how they have left their customers to defend for themselves, they have reconsidered their position and are now going to stand behind me 100% against Nissan Europe. 

Funny thing is that the cost of repair could be a couple hundred quid but Nissan, as you all know, dont fix the gear-box...... they just rip out the whole thing and change it charging you 15000€ for it! 

We´ll see how this ends.... but at the moment its a few months driving a bloody FORD FIESTA 1.2L!!!!!! Arghhhhh!!!!!! :chairshot


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## syclone (Oct 27, 2009)

if i remember the 2010 manual correctly (the 2011 manual the dealer could not supply so far since its delivery from japan is delayed due to the quake), you may drive without VDC but you are obliged to have a POS performed immediately afterwards at your expense to keep your warranty.


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## GTRmallorca (Dec 8, 2010)

syclone said:


> if i remember the 2010 manual correctly (the 2011 manual the dealer could not supply so far since its delivery from japan is delayed due to the quake), you may drive without VDC but you are obliged to have a POS performed immediately afterwards at your expense to keep your warranty.


Another ridiculous scheme from Nissan to part you from your dosh!


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## AndyBrew (Feb 2, 2011)

the whole thing seem positively ridiculous to me and really doesn't do Nissan any favours IMHO.


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## enshiu (Aug 20, 2010)

nissan still thinks we are driving micras. bad bad customer service.

my wheel alignment failed at ......(hidden). after 100 kms.

Bad service and cost 300 pounds for 90 mins?!


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## [email protected] (Nov 16, 2010)

sounds like the clips fell off...i can fix :>)


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## GTRmallorca (Dec 8, 2010)

HI GUYS,

JUST GOT OFF THE PHONE WITH NISSAN ASSISTANCE IN SPAIN AND THEY ARE STILL HOLDING THEIR CLAIM THAT THE GUARANTEE IS VOID IF YOU DRIVE WITH THE ESP OFF.

I REPEAT, THEY ARE NOT GOING TO COVER THE REPARATION COST OR CHANGE THE DAMAGED TRANSMISSION BECAUSE THEY STATE THAT DRIVING WITH THE ESP OFF, VOIDS WARRANTY:..... IS THIS TRUE?

DOES ANYONE KNOW WHO I HAVE TO CONTACT ABOUT THIS SITUATION?

I THOUGHT NISSAN WHERE PRINTING THE NEW WARRANTY BOOKLET?

I ALSO GOT TOLD THAT ALL NEW CUSTOMERS IN SPAIN HAVE TO SIGN A CONTRACT STATING THAT THEY WOULD NOT DRIVE WITH VDC OFF..... IS THAT TRU?

PLEASE HELP NEEDED! BEEN 4 WEEKS WITHOUT CAR!


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## OldBob (Oct 18, 2010)

I know its the 2010 manual and most likely Noth American copy, but rightly or wrongly page 15 of this version of the owners manual does appear to warn of this.
Don't know if there has been any change/publication since. I suspect this is the same as the hard copy I have for my MY10 car (I'll check though)

http://www.nissanextendedwarranty.com/owners-manual/nissan/2010-Nissan-GTR.pdf

I'm no lawyer but I'd have thought the point in question is related to the circumstances in bold in their statement: " Damage to the powertrain or any drivetrain component(s) that occurs when there is a record in the Vehicle Status Data Recorder (VSDR) that the vehicle was driven with VDC off DURING THE PERIOD WHEN THE DAMAGE WAS INCURRED is excluded from warranty coverage.

If they can prove this point/condition when the fault occurred then I guess they can and have in your case refused warranty cover. Is this the case?

The act of once turning VDC off doesn't void the warranty, but if it coincides then that's the case it looks like they're sticking by.

That said I truly hope you get a positive outcome, or some consideration.


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## syclone (Oct 27, 2009)

OldBob said:


> I know its the 2010 manual and most likely Noth American copy, but rightly or wrongly page 15 of this version of the owners manual does appear to warn of this.
> Don't know if there has been any change/publication since. I suspect this is the same as the hard copy I have for my MY10 car (I'll check though)
> 
> http://www.nissanextendedwarranty.com/owners-manual/nissan/2010-Nissan-GTR.pdf
> ...


got my 2011 owner´s manual today. it confirms what i have previously stated (drive with VDC "off" or on a racetrack or under some other circumstances listed in the manual and keep your warranty by having a POS performed immediately afterwards) and also what OldBob wrote above.

the only difference to my earlier post is: a POS performed for whatever reason is free of charge as per the manual.


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## Zed Ed (Oct 24, 2007)

Ask them to show you the evidence that the tranny failed when ESP was off.

Nissan have coughed up in the US on tranny failures for modified cars.......


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## GTRmallorca (Dec 8, 2010)

*All OK*

First of all, thank you all very much for your advice and opinions, they were all very helpful. 

After this mornings call confirming Nissans reluctance to pay for the damages to my transmission, and further threatning of legal action on my behalf, they have finaly come within reason and accepted to change the whole thing on warranty. 

Once again thank you all for your help, I was rest assured by your knowledge.

See you around! :clap:


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## GTRmallorca (Dec 8, 2010)

syclone said:


> got my 2011 owner´s manual today. it confirms what i have previously stated (drive with VDC "off" or on a racetrack or under some other circumstances listed in the manual and keep your warranty by having a POS performed immediately afterwards) and also what OldBob wrote above.
> 
> the only difference to my earlier post is: a POS performed for whatever reason is free of charge as per the manual.


Problem with that is that I live on an island and my HPC is on the mainland, an eight hour ferry ride away. That would mean being without my car for a week and cost Nissan a fortune!


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## Zed Ed (Oct 24, 2007)

GTRmallorca said:


> Problem with that is that I live on an island and my HPC is on the mainland, an eight hour ferry ride away. That would mean being without my car for a week and cost Nissan a fortune!


bear in mind UK owners have been out of their cars for 3 weeks or so once work agreed


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## AndyE14 (Mar 22, 2010)

Slightly OT but related. In the event that a warranty claim is refused unreasonably presumably the only legal recourse is against the supplying dealer rather than the manufacturer is it not?

This is not entirely academic. My wife's car (non-Nissan) went in for service yesterday and they diagnosed that the clutch needed replacement (the car is 2 years old and has done 6800 miles and circa 400 since it's 1 year service last year).


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## OldBob (Oct 18, 2010)

GTRmallorca said:


> First of all, thank you all very much for your advice and opinions, they were all very helpful.
> 
> After this mornings call confirming Nissans reluctance to pay for the damages to my transmission, and further threatning of legal action on my behalf, they have finaly come within reason and accepted to change the whole thing on warranty.
> 
> ...


Great result - another precedent :thumbsup:


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## MIKEGTR (Jul 8, 2005)

AndyE14 said:


> Slightly OT but related. In the event that a warranty claim is refused unreasonably presumably the only legal recourse is against the supplying dealer rather than the manufacturer is it not?
> 
> This is not entirely academic. My wife's car (non-Nissan) went in for service yesterday and they diagnosed that the clutch needed replacement (the car is 2 years old and has done 6800 miles and circa 400 since it's 1 year service last year).


Tell her to stop driving with her foot resting on it then lol


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## enshiu (Aug 20, 2010)

GTRmallorca said:


> First of all, thank you all very much for your advice and opinions, they were all very helpful.
> 
> After this mornings call confirming Nissans reluctance to pay for the damages to my transmission, and further threatning of legal action on my behalf, they have finaly come within reason and accepted to change the whole thing on warranty.
> 
> ...


Nice to hear that and I hope you can stay with your car when they repair the transmission.


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## GTRmallorca (Dec 8, 2010)

enshiu said:


> Nice to hear that and I hope you can stay with your car when they repair the transmission.


They arent repairing the transmission, they just change the whole thing.. My HPC doesnt give a toss as long as they arent paying for it, Nissan is. :clap:


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## GTO NEMESIS (Feb 22, 2007)

Glad to hear that it is being covered by a warranty.
I'm a knats **** away from taking the plunge and selling my 911 Turbo to by a GTR as my daily driver but this sort of thing really does put me off :nervous:

I was planning on going to a couple of dealers to tomorrow to see what deal I could get and the waiting time if I buy a brand new one (although pre owned is preferred if I can find a mint one as I'm not to fond of depreciation!)

Please keep us updated with how long the replacement takes as I've read some scary time lines for these repairs.

Mark
Ps. If the help that these guys have offered you doesn't make you pony up the dough and become a paid member on here then I think it's a pretty poor show on your part :thumbsup:
(Yes I'm not a paid member either but I will be as soon as I buy a GTR  )


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## GTRmallorca (Dec 8, 2010)

GTO NEMESIS said:


> Glad to hear that it is being covered by a warranty.
> I'm a knats **** away from taking the plunge and selling my 911 Turbo to by a GTR as my daily driver but this sort of thing really does put me off :nervous:
> 
> I was planning on going to a couple of dealers to tomorrow to see what deal I could get and the waiting time if I buy a brand new one (although pre owned is preferred if I can find a mint one as I'm not to fond of depreciation!)
> ...


Hi there Nemesis!

Good look with your shopping spree, I hope you end up switching to the GTR, Im sure you won´t be disappointed! 

As for the reparation time.... I was told by my garage´s chief mechanic that it all depended if Nissan had transmissions at Europe HQ. If not, they had to be shipped from Japan which could take longer due to their unfortunate disasters lately.. I was told that once the transmission was at their garage it would only take a couple days max to change.... A week has passed since Nissan agreed to pay for the reparation..five weeks since I sent the car.. :chairshot

And was your P.S intended for me??? First of all, I had no clue that you could even join this club as a paying member, the first time I found out was when I posted this post! And second of all, if I lived in the UK I would be a member and would attend club meetings and events, but I dont, so theres not much point..


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