# Does your Skyline 'splutter'



## tarmac terror (Jul 16, 2003)

Ever since I got my R32GTR it has had the most random misfire. Happens at ANY manifold pressure -/+ and at ANY RPM. Just a single miss maybe once in about 15 mins...bizarre!! You can feel the miss while driving and its starting to really annoy the hell out of me.
In order to try and cure it I've put in new plugs and splitfire coils. 
Got a feeling it might be the coil loom breaking down as its VERY brittle feeling and having designed cables for a living I know this is not good. Also think it might be the ign amp on its way out,
Had thoughts about the ECU as well which leads me to this poll. I would be interested to find out if any other owners have/dont have this random miss and what ECU you run.

TT


----------



## V1H (Aug 30, 2001)

no misfire the way you described, however, did have one stutter/hesitation once, accelerating in top and at full boost, changed the plugs from '7' to '8' and didn't experience it again.


----------



## SteveN (Aug 6, 2002)

Trouble with missfires n shit is people and companies dont actually know the problem, so just change everything one at a time and charge you for it all, even though in reality youd not need most of it.
In reality, though it takes more skill, is to truly find the buggered part rather than buying new bits at random.

The amount of times ive seen minor missfires caused by minor hardware/software issues "cured" by fitting a completely different managment system that the tuner in questions understands better is unbelivable.

I know of a recent case (non skyline) that what was almost deffo a sub-500quid component problem ended up a 7k mega overhaul as the company just changed everything as they blatantly didnt know what was wrong, and are claiming it all was needed...


----------



## moleman (Jun 3, 2002)

TT, what ECU? PFC? If it is, it's a common problem. I've had it forever although nowhere near every 15 mins.

and...



SteveN said:


> I know of a recent case (non skyline) that what was almost deffo a sub-500quid component problem ended up a 7k mega overhaul as the company just changed everything as they blatantly didnt know what was wrong, and are claiming it all was needed...


...ouch!


----------



## tarmac terror (Jul 16, 2003)

yes moleman, normal PFC.

TT


----------



## Butuz (Jan 9, 2005)

Check your AFM's - i had a completeley random misfire / stutter and eventually engine stalling problem that took me ages to find, and it was one faulty AFM = if i wiggled the plug, the engine would splutter, and sometimes stall outright. Changed AFM for a known good one and engine runs sweet as ever since.

Random - but true!

Butuz


----------



## Simonh (May 24, 2002)

A freind of mine has just identified an engine stutter with his car (non-skyline) and traced it to the alternator output dropping for a very brief moment, he was considering lazy injectors, coilpack faults and all sorts of stuff when the real problem came to light.

Simon


----------



## tarmac terror (Jul 16, 2003)

Butuz said:


> Check your AFM's - i had a completeley random misfire / stutter and eventually engine stalling problem that took me ages to find, and it was one faulty AFM = if i wiggled the plug, the engine would splutter, and sometimes stall outright. Changed AFM for a known good one and engine runs sweet as ever since.
> 
> Random - but true!
> 
> Butuz


Thanks mate but the cars had new Nismo AFM's and new injectors all fitted and mapped at Abbey about 12 weeks ago. Had all the symptoms you describe before and was indeed AFM on the blink hence new Nismo's. Car would cut out at random, sometimes in the most awkward places.

Still got this one random miss every so often. Grrrrrr....

TT


----------



## lynchy (Aug 21, 2004)

It's a very common problem with the PFC. It just misses occasionally. They all do it AFAIK. Generally it occurs during cruising at the transition from negative to positive boost. Doesn't seem to occur when giving it some. 

I've got a PFC on my R33 GTR and I get it too.


----------



## ericgtr (Jun 23, 2007)

hi,
i am using d-jet for about 9 months no problem at all.


----------



## TREG (May 20, 2004)

Butuz said:


> Check your AFM's - i had a completeley random misfire / stutter and eventually engine stalling problem that took me ages to find, and it was one faulty AFM = if i wiggled the plug, the engine would splutter, and sometimes stall outright. Changed AFM for a known good one and engine runs sweet as ever since.
> 
> Random - but true!
> 
> Butuz




Mine spits,splutters and back fires, god knows why?
Could you give us non mechanic minded guys a clue on how to fin the Afm on a Gtr 33??


----------



## shade (Nov 28, 2006)

The AFM's are just after your air filters. They have a plug wired to them.

I took mine off and gave em' a good spray with carb cleaner and my cold running issues dissappeared for a while! I get a bit of splutter again now when cold. Might clean em' again.
I also get some pops from the exhaust.


----------



## TREG (May 20, 2004)

shade said:


> The AFM's are just after your air filters. They have a plug wired to them.
> 
> I took mine off and gave em' a good spray with carb cleaner and my cold running issues dissappeared for a while! I get a bit of splutter again now when cold. Might clean em' again.
> I also get some pops from the exhaust.




Thanks mate, will go and have a look today


----------



## TREG (May 20, 2004)

Just been out and gave the contacts a clean, so will see how she is in the next few days.


----------



## Saborion (Apr 5, 2005)

By splutter you mean the car doing a "hickup"? I get that randomly, also using a Power FC.


----------



## leeaids (May 8, 2007)

my 33 gtr has had a misfire for about 2 months now, no matter what i try it dont work iv changed the pugs, the coils, the afms, even tried reading the ecu codes, still no luck


----------



## ericgtr (Jun 23, 2007)

Saborion said:


> By splutter you mean the car doing a "hickup"? I get that randomly, also using a Power FC.


hi ru using l jet or d jet cause i have been using d jet for along time no problem at all. maybe u can try adding some earth wire on your car.


----------



## tarmac terror (Jul 16, 2003)

Saborion said:


> By splutter you mean the car doing a "hickup"? I get that randomly, also using a Power FC.


Yes, thats what I mean. Just one 'hiccup' every so often.



> maybe u can try adding some earth wire on your car.


Fitted a GTROC grounding kit which is a great peice of kit. Noticed an improvement in other areas but 'hiccup' still present.



> It's a very common problem with the PFC. It just misses occasionally. They all do it AFAIK. Generally it occurs during cruising at the transition from negative to positive boost. Doesn't seem to occur when giving it some.


This is what I suspected. I thought I'd organise a poll just to get an idea of how many folks get this. Interested to see that some normal (non d-jetro) PFC users dont get any hiccups at all. Obviously not all PFC's are made equal. Be interesting to see why some folks get hiccups and others dont.

TT


----------



## Saborion (Apr 5, 2005)

ericgtr said:


> hi ru using l jet or d jet cause i have been using d jet for along time no problem at all. maybe u can try adding some earth wire on your car.


Using AFM's (non D-Jetro).


----------



## TREG (May 20, 2004)

Car behaved well, may of cured it!!!


----------



## ericgtr (Jun 23, 2007)

i think mainly about the tuner and tuning.it makes a lot of differents.depands how much effort he puts in


----------



## REDLINE (Aug 11, 2007)

V1H said:


> no misfire the way you described, however, did have one stutter/hesitation once, accelerating in top and at full boost, changed the plugs from '7' to '8' and didn't experience it again.


Hey ive got this problem, i fitted denso's ik16 and soon after it started to do what u said. u have gtr or gts? and which plugs u fitted to correct the problem (make/part number) would be gratful for any advise advise...


----------



## tarmac terror (Jul 16, 2003)

Hmm, this is starting to get worse........
When driving on the motorway at 60mph (2800rpm) it chuggs all over the place. Put the foot down to 70mph(3000rpm) and it gets better. Go to 80mph(3200rpm) and its all but gone.Been putting in V-Power with octane booster as I thought it may be the fuel but thats not helped one bit..
I'm going to order a new coil loom and see if I can borrow an ignitor to check its not that. Failing that its back to the rollers/dynapack for a checkup. Bloody strange and its starting to REALLY annoy me.

TT


----------



## V1H (Aug 30, 2001)

fao REDLINE, 

its a gtr, running approx 450 with fconSZ, i had ngk bcpr7eix which had been fine up to that point but i should really be using '8', so pop in ngk IRITOP '8' (bcpr8 iridium 0.8mm gap) and hasn't happened again. hth.


----------



## REDLINE (Aug 11, 2007)

V1H said:


> fao REDLINE,
> 
> its a gtr, running approx 450 with fconSZ, i had ngk bcpr7eix which had been fine up to that point but i should really be using '8', so pop in ngk IRITOP '8' (bcpr8 iridium 0.8mm gap) and hasn't happened again. hth.


nope its a gts-t...
i asked at my local part shop and on there systems no NGK irdium plug comes up for 2.5 gts-t, only platinum NGk's


----------



## leeaids (May 8, 2007)

tarmac terror said:


> Hmm, this is starting to get worse........
> When driving on the motorway at 60mph (2800rpm) it chuggs all over the place. Put the foot down to 70mph(3000rpm) and it gets better. Go to 80mph(3200rpm) and its all but gone.Been putting in V-Power with octane booster as I thought it may be the fuel but thats not helped one bit..
> I'm going to order a new coil loom and see if I can borrow an ignitor to check its not that. Failing that its back to the rollers/dynapack for a checkup. Bloody strange and its starting to REALLY annoy me.
> 
> TT


yeeah mate know how you feel, mine been doing it since june, tried afms coils, new plugs still there it poor


----------



## tarmac terror (Jul 16, 2003)

Yeah cars even had splitfire coils not that long ago. I can see me scouring the boards for a used Motec or Fcon Pro if this keeps up. Its making me dislike the car intensely.
I've looked at the map trace on the commander to see if theres anything dodgy going on there but no. Even the map cells used at 60mph cruise seem to be in order when comparing the values to its neighbouring cells.
Seems PFC itself may be causing the problem (judging by the responses to the poll).
Anyone know off hand where the ECU earthing point is?? Is it near the ECU itself,at the main earthing point or somewhere else? Its the only other thing I can think of at this point in time.

TT


----------



## Madden (Nov 14, 2004)

I know the power Fc has a common problem and mine does it say once a week if that and all it does is hold back for under a second.

I have heard the the Slitfire coils can brake down really quickly. Im still running stock coils that are around 18 years old and they have never caused any problems.

I had a missfire on my old gtr and it was the coil wiring loom. It had gone brittle from all the heat under there.

Good luck sorting it mate


----------



## tarmac terror (Jul 16, 2003)

New coil loom in, new ignitor in, BOV's removed, Loads of vac pipes replaced etc...

AND ITS STILL THERE!!!!! 

I suspect either FPR or the turbos themselves are on the way out.

Incidentally, can anyone tell me what indications there are on a GTR of impending failure of one or both turbos. Obviously smoking etc but I'm talikng more of how the car FEELS when the turbos are going??

TT


----------



## DaveV (Feb 27, 2007)

I'd borrow a know good CAS and try that before buying anything else, i've read they can cause the symptoms you are getting when they are failing and it's a very easy swap


----------



## murano3 (Mar 23, 2005)

Yep - try the CAS, I started having hiccups when the bearings started to go in the CAS - I replaced everything before finding out it was the CAS at fault - in the end it failed completely ... fitted another one - been perfect ever since - on mine it was obvious as when you took it out and span the spiggot it was catching ... where they should run smooth.


----------



## stumpybrown (Apr 4, 2006)

Whats a CAS? Pardom ny ignorance...


----------



## stumpybrown (Apr 4, 2006)

And bad spelling...


----------



## murano3 (Mar 23, 2005)

It's the crank angle sensor - it's the little grey device that sits on the front your RB26  - it contains a little disk with notches that merrily spins around  

"The Crank Angle Sensor (CAS) is a device used in the automobile to tell the Engine Control Unit (ECU) when to fire the spark plugs. The CAS detects where the piston is located in the engine and when it is in the right spot it tells the ECU to fire the spark plug in that cylinder.

The sensor is typically located on the flywheel or on a separate cog. One of the teeth of the flywheel is missing, the one exactly at Top Dead Center of cylinder #1 (the closest to the flywheel).

The sensor registers a change and responding to this, sends out a pulse to the ECU. The ECU is then able to calculate the injection and ignition timing. There are two commonly applied versions of this sensor, based on the principle of induction and on the Hall effect. This sensor is the most important sensor in modern day engines. When it is failing, the engine will not run at all."


----------



## hodgie (Oct 23, 2003)

tarmac terror said:


> Incidentally, can anyone tell me what indications there are on a GTR of impending failure of one or both turbos. Obviously smoking etc but I'm talikng more of how the car FEELS when the turbos are going??
> 
> TT


One of mine went last year. The car suddenly started using stupid amounts of oil. 4 Ltrs for 4 -500 miles. It was going into the intercooler pipes.
A good place to look first is in the pipes after the air filters. If theres oil then they are definately suspect.


----------



## tarmac terror (Jul 16, 2003)

*cough* Its a CAM angle sensor...this one's been covered before :chuckle:

I'll get a new one sorted out from RHDJapan. Was going to buy one anyway.

Hodgie - there WAS a reasonable bit of oil in the front turbo cast inlet pipe (bit directly bolted onto front turbo) the other day when I fittd my suction kit. I am fairly sure 1 or both are on their way out as car smokes a small bit when on boost. Just not sure if their impending failure is the cause of the symptoms I am experiencing.
At the moment I've narrowed it down to either FPR,turbos/dodgy wastegate actuators, CAM angle sensor OR dodgy vac pipe. Replaced most of the vac piping but thee are a couple I missed.

I can see a call to GT-aRt coming up soon if I cant get it sorted by mid-Feb. As an experienced mechanic you've gotta know when to start employing specialist knowledge :chuckle:. I could spend a fortune replacing bits I SUSPECT of being dodgy. A specialist should be able to narrow it down much faster/cheaper with diagnostic tools etc that I just do not posess.


TT


----------



## Chi (Mar 19, 2008)

tarmac terror said:


> Hmm, this is starting to get worse........
> When driving on the motorway at 60mph (2800rpm) it chuggs all over the place. Put the foot down to 70mph(3000rpm) and it gets better. Go to 80mph(3200rpm) and its all but gone.Been putting in V-Power with octane booster as I thought it may be the fuel but thats not helped one bit..
> I'm going to order a new coil loom and see if I can borrow an ignitor to check its not that. Failing that its back to the rollers/dynapack for a checkup. Bloody strange and its starting to REALLY annoy me.
> 
> TT


That sounds like what mine is doin!


----------



## goddard (Aug 20, 2005)

Out of interest does it do this without the air conditioning turned on?

When my AC is on it turns itself on and off every few minutes and it feels like a misfire.

Just my tuppence.


----------



## tarmac terror (Jul 16, 2003)

I binned the AC a good while back.
Strangely this symptom dissapeared to be replaced by what I can only describe as a 'brick wall' effect when hitting about 0.3Bar of boost. Car boosts fine now past the transition point but bogs terminally at this boost level and cannot be driven through it. Additionally, during this event it chucks fuel out the back like its going out of fashion. Bizarrely it will rev cleanly all the way up to 6k+ as long as it sees a boost level no greater than this.
My 3 suspects are:-
Blown turbo.
Air Leak.
PFC map no longer being representative of engine spec.

The last one is a bit of a 'last resort' excuse TBH. Since it was last mapped, the only things I have added have been a trust suction kit and a larger intercooler. I would not have thought that the addition of these two items would necessitate a remap. However, I suppose its still a reasonable theory.

I've decided to swap the std turbos out with a spare set I acquired and see if that helps. Also I've found a place that sells 80mm piping so I'm going to make my own hard pipe kit for the off-side. Now if either of these fixes does not work then my only course of action is to book it in with a specialist. 

TT


----------



## tweenierob (Aug 5, 2003)

It is a firmware issue with the power fc, give it a month or so and i'll have a fix for all of you. 
Forget about changing parts, save your money.

Rob


----------



## Cid_Casterwick (Apr 16, 2007)

I doubt this is anything similar but by reading a few of the problems I may have had the same issue. When i first got my car it would do something similar, but mine was more of a hick-up or total shut down. Like driving along it would feel as though the clutch were randomly pressed in, the car would fall flat on its face, then suddenly pick back up. The car sat for a good week while this was all happening, took it out and it was fighting me like mad! Could get no acceleration from her at all! nowhere over 2k revs and it it would "shut down" kept on it eventually getting her to speed and then she became more stable. Once stable i blasted the throttle! Now, never had another problem, car runs fine, no idea what was going on.:runaway:


----------



## Domo-kun (Mar 2, 2007)

*It's a PFC ECU-bug*

Hymmm. I got it too (R32 GT-R). I have Apexi PFC, the latest model with Commander.

It's a PFC bug. At least that's what people are saying in SAU forum. 
Some Subarus have the same issue.
My friend has the D-Jetro setup (R32 GT-R), he also has it.

It misses the spark on one round of the engines rpm scale. So, The PFC just shuts down for one compete rpm, that's it. 
He found it out when mapping he's car, the D-jet version (latest version of it).
Mine happens every now and then, usually when cruising steady between 80-140 km/h.

Some people also have found a cure for this, when they just gave an extra earth (–) to the Ignitor box. 
(in R32 & R33 the box is located at the back of the spark plug cover. In R34 ignitors are build into the coils).

Just do this, and see if it helps (extra ground wires from the Ignitor box). Engine pic of matt j's car 










My 2 cents for this thread...


----------



## ExScoobyT (Jan 6, 2004)

Rob - got any more info?


----------



## Steve (Sep 21, 2001)

Not a mis-fire, more of a cough !!


----------



## stevo (Feb 15, 2008)

I think i too may have the Apexi hiccups


----------



## JKGTR (Apr 7, 2010)

iv got apexi power FC and i got this "hickkup" maybe once every 100miles.


----------



## drewzer (Jun 22, 2009)

so do any of the well know tunners have a fix or update for this issue?


----------



## G40tee (Feb 25, 2008)

same thing, the old 'power fc miss' as ive heard it called by a few tuners LOL

confidence inspiring eh 

get it every now and again, odd cough then nothing at all. Doesnt cause any warnings or knock readings etc. Car runs as smoothly as it was before the hiccup.


----------



## SteffanChyzak (Sep 12, 2010)

I've just changed my plugs and put in some splitfire coil packs so hoping to keep on avoiding the misfire bug


----------



## SteffanChyzak (Sep 12, 2010)

I think that the problem on mine is the fuel pressure regulator as when it splutters the aftermarket gauge goes mental. If not next it will be Z32 mafs to instal as I've done the plugs and coil packs which have made no difference. The splitfires have made no difference to running either so was hoping for a bit more pop on the idle etc.


----------



## lgunnz (Jan 28, 2010)

Mine does it so rarely that I only think of trying to fix it only when it happens, once every 2 weeks or so...but I do have a pfc so it looks like that may be my problem. I only notice it when I'm going up the hill that leads to my house around 70kph


----------

