# Car randomly died...



## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Hey all. Question time! A few weeks ago I was merrily driving along when all of a sudden, mid corner and off boost, the engine cut out. Attempted to restart the car, but it wouldn't have it, even jumping it off another car. 

The situation:


The engine turns over on the starter motor and nothing is obviously mechanically knackered. 
Connections on the CAS and the ignition amp have been checked. 
A new coilpack loom has been put in.
A different ignition amp has been tried. 
I have not yet used a timing gun to check whether there's a definite spark
Fuel pump is making priming noise when ignition is turned on but I haven't yet checked fuel pressure. 
Nissan Datascan shows an RPM reading when engine being turned over, and injectors can be heard clicking which I believe rules the CAS out as being the fault. 
There is definitely fuel in the tank, over half a tank full. 
After a certain amount of time attempting to start the car, you can smell fuel emanating from the exhaust. 

I believe it's lack of a spark, but that's just a guess, and I really need to get a timing gun on there but does anything immediately come to mind to people?


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## KM BlackGTR (Mar 17, 2009)

Sounds like the CAS to me !


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## Natbrat300 (Mar 6, 2012)

Why don't you check for a spark the old fashion way!


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

I haven't checked for a spark in any way yet due to it having rained for the last 40 days and 40 nights


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## Natbrat300 (Mar 6, 2012)

Tell me about it!


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

*bump*


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## davew (Apr 28, 2003)

If you get stuck we can get it recovered to our workshop?

Kindest regards


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## r32r33r34r35 (Jan 17, 2011)

Check on the plug that goes on the fuel system ontop of the tank. Mine came loose as the rubber inside was causing a issue. I had exactly the same issue as you


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Car's in Guernsey Dave so I hope your recovery truck floats  Thanks for offer though. 

r32r33r34r35, I'll check that out. Is that the fuel pump connection you're talking about?


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## old git (Jan 10, 2013)

Hi,if you find you have spark I would be looking at AFM.Glad I don't have them anymore.


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## r32r33r34r35 (Jan 17, 2011)

Yes the fuel pump plug which is normally in the boot under the carpet in a r32 gtr not too sure about other models


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## davew (Apr 28, 2003)

hahaaa we don't have a recovery ferry im afraid LOL!



CabbageMS said:


> Car's in Guernsey Dave so I hope your recovery truck floats  Thanks for offer though.
> 
> r32r33r34r35, I'll check that out. Is that the fuel pump connection you're talking about?


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## RXXXIV (Sep 3, 2007)

Faulty AFM will not cause your car not to start at all anymore. It makes it run like a pig and depending on ECU set the car in limp mode limiting the rpm to 2000
but it will start. Also it would normally not cause the car/engine to cut off in such a harsh way while driving/running.

Basically it's always the same things to check as you need fuel, spark and air. Air shouldn't be an issue so you're at fuel and spark.

So double checking following certainly isn't a bad idea.

Fuel pump
Fuel pump control module (if used at all)
Fuel lines
Fuel filter
Fuel pressure regulator
Injectors
CAS
Ignition amplifier (if available)
Coilpacks
Spark plugs
ECU
Wiring in general (saying fuel related and ignition related)

Also check your compression while having coilpacks and spark plugs off/out as obviously if there is something seriously wrong with the engine itself it won't run right or at all either.

Good luck with sorting this out mate!


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## old git (Jan 10, 2013)

AFM caused my car to cut out totally and would not start several times had to have it towed.Once re-soldered it was OK.


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## gts-tom (Jun 14, 2010)

Dare I say it but have you checked your cam belt.


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## D-Ranged (Aug 16, 2007)

I have some excellent condition afms for sale if needed.


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## tarmac terror (Jul 16, 2003)

old git said:


> AFM caused my car to cut out totally and would not start several times had to have it towed.Once re-soldered it was OK.


My R32 used to cut out randomly whilst driving too!! The first couple of times it was rather disconcerting...could always bump it when it was still moving but if the car had to physically stop then sometimes it could be a pig to start using key.

Changed AFM's and problem disappeared!!!


TT


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## Olly-R (Aug 15, 2008)

On my r33 gtr, it cut out once and lost it spark then was ok then happened again 2 months later, no spark permanently , down by the engine ecu is two blue relays one of mine had poor connections and had been arcing on the contacts hence no power to coil loom or sparks, cleaned them ( relay not designed to be stripped so cut open ;-) ) and all ok, then ordered two new ones from nissan £85 ;-) , all sorted car driving better than ever. Buys that's just my experience with my gtr.


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## Olly-R (Aug 15, 2008)

So do you have injector pulse? Spark output and correct valve timing?


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## Jimbostir (Dec 2, 2008)

If you've got an rpm reading then the cas is working and turning fine. You can here the pile pump, and injectors and you can smell fuel. You've also checked and swapped the amp. The only thing I would say from that is check the main live feed into the amp. I've not had a look on the diagram but there's usually a relay feeding ignition. I'd be looking for that.


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## Jimbostir (Dec 2, 2008)

(That's meant to say fuel pump)


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

So two people think it could be the ignition relay... I don't particulary like the sound of chopping open something that isn't supposed to be chopped open but it sounds like it could be worth a look. 

Doubt the cambelts gone as it was changed about 5000 miles ago.


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Ok so an update, it definitely has a spark. 

Fuel pump definitely running but when you listen to the fuel rail it does sound like the fuels rushing through there... could it be that the regulator has given up and isn't holding enough pressure? I need to find my self a fuel pressure tester.


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## Natbrat300 (Mar 6, 2012)

How do you know the fuel pump is running? You won't be able to hear it over the attesa pump from inside the car?

Also, you state that you have change the amplifier etc..., if this was the cause, it could now be badly flooded through attempts to start and unless you know what you are doing you will never get it started if it is badly flooded.


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Ahhh i thought the Attessa pump was under the bonnet near the battery. I can hear pump running at the back of the car and can hear fuel rushing through the fuel rail. 

The car may be flooded yes, although the spark plug I took out to check for spark was dry...


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## KM BlackGTR (Mar 17, 2009)

I'm surprised you say you can here the pump running as it won't run unless
The engine fires up & runs. The pump only runs for a few seconds while you crank. Someone correct me if I am wrong but the pump does not run just with the ignition turned on. If you have been cranking the eng over tho your plugs will be wetted just from the initial priming run of the pump.


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Yeah sorry what I meant was I can hear the pump do it's initial 5 second priming thing, then it stops.


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## RXXXIV (Sep 3, 2007)

Fuel pump does run when ignition is turned on. It runs for a few seconds to prime and build up pressure then stops and continues running when engine is turned on.

Regarding flooded engine if you take out the spark plugs and leave them for a bit fuel will evaporate and engine will be fine to start as long as there is no technical issue holding it up from firing and running.


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## Natbrat300 (Mar 6, 2012)

If the engine is badly flooded, it will have bore wash and even a new set of plugs will not start it. BMW 6 cylinder engines are notorious for this problem. 

Do you not know a friendly mechanic who can come and take a look?


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## Jimbostir (Dec 2, 2008)

^bmw 5 series over 50000miles! ^
A simple way to see if it's got pressure is to squeeze the fuel pipe at the filter although it's not very accurate but it will give you an idea. If it's got no pressure then disconnect a hose and see if you're getting a good amount of fuel on prime. 
If it is flooded you can hear straight away if you know what you're listening for (lower compression). If not then youl have to get it checked over by a mechanic


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Ok. I'll leave the plugs out to air the cylinders tomorrow but I highly doubt it's fixed itself since it cut out when driving.


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## gts-tom (Jun 14, 2010)

When you say it cut out when driving have you since changed the ignition amp or did you do it before. Reason I ask is if the amp is failing it will cause the car to cut out while running perfectly. I would also definitely clean up the plugs.


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

I changed the amp since it cut out (admittedly with another second hand one) and it made no difference to it's efforts to start.


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## Jimbostir (Dec 2, 2008)

You said its definatley got a spark.


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Yeah it's got a spark. 

Just checked fuel pressure at the rail and it was at about 2.7 bar with the ignition on. 

On Nissan Datascan it shows the water temp sensor as reading 0 so I assume there's some kind of sensor error or earth problem there. I manually put the water temp to 10 degrees but it made no difference. 

Now charging battery up for next try... 

So still nothing obvious. Is there anyway to check if the injectors are getting a signal with a multimeter? (although I'm sure I can hear them clicking when I get someone else to turn the engine over.


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Spark is a bit weak and girly to be fair. It's orangey yellow rather than the normal sharp blue colour you get


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Ok so took the plugs out, cleaned them up, turned the motor over for a few seconds with them out and the CAS disconnected, left the plugs out for 30 mins. Put it back together... and still nothing.


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## Jimbostir (Dec 2, 2008)

Did the plugs have fuel on them? If so it's injecting. You can check injector pulse with a good meter. Put ignition on and disconnect one injector. Youl have battery voltage to one side. That's your positive feed. The other side will be switched earth. Plug injector back on and measure voltage at the back of the plug between battery positive and switched earth. Your looking at about 1.5 volts give or take on cranking.
Although if you've gone this far and still not found te problem you may be have to get it looked at by a mechanic. It's got to be something your missing.


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

It was difficult to tell how wet they were to be honest although a couple seemed reasonably wet. Ill do that voltage test on the injectors tomorrow.


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

I took a look at getting a reading off the back of the plug injector but can't see any way of getting a probe onto anything. 

I replaced the water temp sensor as that was showing zero degrees in Datascan, it now shows 8 degrees which is probably about right. 

Sprayed WD-40 into plenum then went and gave it a crank and no joy, although I'm not sure whether that'd only work if someone was spraying the WD in while the engine was being cranked rather than before it was being cranked. 

This problem is a pain in the ass! I'm beginning to think it is a weak spark causing the problem. I haven't changed the ECU yet as I can't get the passenger door open to access it due to where the car is positioned.


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## R33JONO (Aug 17, 2011)

I would try a pair of known good afm's


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## steve_gts4 (Nov 30, 2009)

noone has suggested the alternator.. the alternator in my r32 died from age.
its an easy one to test and rule out, too..
what voltage do you read across the battery when the car is off vs when its running?


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Hi Steve, I can't read voltage across battery when the car is running as I can't get it started


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## R32 Combat (Jan 29, 2004)

I think you need to change the ecu. The only sensor the ecu needs to run is the cas. All other sensors can fail the car can still start/run and drive.


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

I tried changing the ECU this afternoon but it made no difference.


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## Olly-R (Aug 15, 2008)

Does it run on easy start? Take the boost pipe off plenum and try ?


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## Smiffy415 (Jan 15, 2014)

How wet are the plugs after cranking? 
Have you compression tested the engine yet?


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Plugs don't seem that wet to be honest, haven't checked compression yet


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## Smiffy415 (Jan 15, 2014)

If there's anything I've learned from fault finding it's this - never overlook the basics. 
Don't just go swapping things before you've checked the basics out. When the car first broke down/stalled you were in the perfect position to start fault finding. 

For an engine to stall suddenly you need to have lost either a fuel supply, ignition/spark or compression. 

Find out which you don't have, post it up and then we can work backwards from there. 

Ad.


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## tarmac terror (Jul 16, 2003)

Smiffy415 said:


> If there's anything I've learned from fault finding it's this - never overlook the basics.
> Don't just go swapping things before you've checked the basics out. When the car first broke down/stalled you were in the perfect position to start fault finding.
> 
> For an engine to stall suddenly you need to have lost either a fuel supply, ignition/spark or compression.
> ...


This.....

Unless its a poxy electrical gremlin (which can be a proper PITA), finding the source of the problem shouldn't be overly difficult or challenging. An internal combustion engine needs 3 things in order to function...air, fuel, spark so finding which one it aint got should be easy. 
Annoying, intermittent stuff like a faulty fuel pump, dodgy reg or AFM will certainly take extra time to diagnose but shouldn't stop you from finding the problem.

Good luck in finding the fault. Just be methodical and consider EVERYTHING and you should get there in the end.

TT


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## harryturbo (Jan 24, 2004)

*ig amp*

its worth a try wiggling ignition amp conections they can come loose or even break


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Ignition amp loom has had plenty of wiggles. 

I'm gona get a noid light and see if the injectors are getting a signal. I think I've been reasonably methodical so far.


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## tarmac terror (Jul 16, 2003)

CabbageMS said:


> I think I've been reasonably methodical so far.


I agree..

I'm probably just as interested to find the reason behind this fault as you are!! Got my curiosity piqued...

TT


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

So the noid light won't light up... but if I turn the CAS by hand I'm certain I can hear the injectors clicking away. 

I don't have any easystart to hand so a drop of petrol down the bores it is...


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## Smiffy415 (Jan 15, 2014)

CabbageMS said:


> So the noid light won't light up... but if I turn the CAS by hand I'm certain I can hear the injectors clicking away.
> 
> I don't have any easystart to hand so a drop of petrol down the bores it is...


So it looks like your injectors aren't receiving a signal? Do you have a good spark and compression? 

Ad


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Haven't got a compression test gauge here so will check that as soon as can.


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## Smiffy415 (Jan 15, 2014)

I would mate, I doubt it's going to be compression related but it just makes the diagnosis procedure a lot easier. It's all about ruling things out for definite, the more you rule out the less places there are to look for the problem. 

Sorry if my first post came across as a bit arsey too, it wasn't my intention at all mate. I work in the trade and see a lot of people with faults on their cars who have been to garages who just start swapping and replacing expensive parts before they know exactly what the problem is.


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

No worries chap, I appreciate that approach! 

I've got a mate coming round tomorrow who's in the trade and builds a lot of hillclimb engines on the side so maybe he'll be able to spot something I haven't. 

I'm concerned the spark is too weak. Does anyone know whether the spark normally looks crisp and blue (which I'm sure I remember it used to) or whether it should be an orange fattish spark?


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## Hazz (Jan 6, 2014)

You're correct in your assessment of the weak orange spark, it should be a blue/purple. Suggest checking your battery, earths and alternator? (apologies if you have, I've only read the last page).


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Ok so I took a quick look at the cambelt position yesterday to see if it's skipped a tooth. This is the crank pulley position with the camshaft pulleys lined up with their respective marks on the head. Does it look far enough out to be out by a whole tooth?


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

No compression on 2nd cylinder and 5th cylinder...


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## simon tompkins (Aug 14, 2005)

bad luck fella but that sounds like rebuild time,if you can afford to make a forged engine you will be better off (do it once do it right)take your time and plan what your goals are,that saves you money in the long run.



simon


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## Smiffy415 (Jan 15, 2014)

CabbageMS said:


> No compression on 2nd cylinder and 5th cylinder...


Is the cam timing out?


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Didn't take the crank pulley off but it's almost bang on, it's possible it's out by a tooth I guess but it's very close.


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## scoooby slayer (Jun 13, 2009)

if you've got no compression on 2 cylinders it should still be firing ?

I was still driving mine sounded like a Scooby and had just 50 psi on 1 and 2 and still started ok.


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## Smiffy415 (Jan 15, 2014)

Sounds peculiar if the cam timing isn't far out. 

Doesn't explain why the engine won't run as it would still run on 4 cylinders I would have thought. Are the compressions just low or is there literally zero?


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## Natbrat300 (Mar 6, 2012)

Sounds very peculiar, if there is genuinely no compression on 2 and 5. 

Have you removed the cam covers and made sure that both camshafts are intact and turning. It is possible that one camshaft has snapped.


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## Jimbostir (Dec 2, 2008)

Are you checking everything properly? So there's absolutely no compression on 2 cylinders and the others are fine and yet it's not firing at all? Don't sound right to me. In the nicest possible way: if you haven't got a clue yet as to what it is I think you should get somebody to check it over for you.


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

@ Jimbo: Unfortunately mate Guernsey is hardly full of good garages for working on this kinda car. I have however had a mechanic from one of the garages come and have a look at it, he's got a background of building hillclimb engines and is well respected locally. I'm waiting on his response to this new info. 

@ Nat: I'll whip the covers off and have a look at some point! 

@ Smiffy: literally 0 psi on 2 and 5. I've got 90 on cylinder 1, 0 on 2, 55 on 3, 40 on 4, 0 on 5 and 100 on 6.


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## scoooby slayer (Jun 13, 2009)

CabbageMS said:


> @ Jimbo: Unfortunately mate Guernsey is hardly full of good garages for working on this kinda car. I have however had a mechanic from one of the garages come and have a look at it, he's got a background of building hillclimb engines and is well respected locally. I'm waiting on his response to this new info.
> 
> @ Nat: I'll whip the covers off and have a look at some point!
> 
> @ Smiffy: literally 0 psi on 2 and 5. I've got 90 on cylinder 1, 0 on 2, 55 on 3, 40 on 4, 0 on 5 and 100 on 6.


there is something very odd with those compression results, have you definitely got an accurate tester ? 
what did the car do when it broke down exactly ?


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

I agree it's weird. Unsure whether the tester is accurate but no reason to doubt it it's one I've borrowed off someone. So 4 mins or so before it broke down I gave it maybe 3 seconds of full throttle and I did hear a weird metallic scraping, like the exhaust on the ground, backed off. Then a few minutes later I went rounds. Corner, off throttle and it cut out mid corner and wouldn't restart. The whole journey I wasn't really driving hard and the car makes stock power.


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## Natbrat300 (Mar 6, 2012)

Are you running standard turbos?

I think your engine has ingested a turbine and damaged your valves / bores!


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Yeah I thought that to (it is on standard turbs) but if cylinder 2 and 5 have gone then that'd have meant both turbos will have failed simultaneously?


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## Natbrat300 (Mar 6, 2012)

Doesn't matter which turbo fails, there's only one inlet on the plenum chamber!


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## scoooby slayer (Jun 13, 2009)

Natbrat300 said:


> Doesn't matter which turbo fails, there's only one inlet on the plenum chamber!


hows it gonna get through the intercooler ? 

if the engine is going to ingest anything it will be from exhaust side.


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## scoooby slayer (Jun 13, 2009)

ingesting a turbo is not the cause imo the car wouldn't of died. 
most likely cam related and why you've got no compression, and I am a mechanic by trade. 

where do you live op ?

The only logical explanation to me is a camshaft problem, it's not likey a bottom end failed like that at both ends of the block simultaneously, how does it sound while cranking on the starter?


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## Natbrat300 (Mar 6, 2012)

Hmmm, but like he said if 2 and 5 have gone, that would mean both turbos has failed simultaneously on the exhaust side.

Think it is a head off job now either way!

Take cam covers off first and see what's going on there first.


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

I live in Guernsey dude.

I'm hoping its cam related rather than bottom end. It sounds smooth when cranking, it does sound like it's lost some compression. I can't really describe it any better than that.


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## Smiffy415 (Jan 15, 2014)

Leak down test is the next logical step then, find out where you're losing the compression and hopefully should point you in a direction of repair. 

As of yet we're still to uncover the cause of the original stall of the engine, the turbo idea doesn't sound feasible but you can't rule it out until you've done a leak down. 

The cam idea is interesting, I haven't had one apart but I'm guessing the CAS takes drive from the end of the exhaust cam?


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Yeah cas takes drive off exhaust cam.

I don't actually have the stuff here to do a leak down test although I do have a compressor. I'll ask mr mechanic friend if he has the adaptor.


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

So checked the intake camshaft and nothing to see really. I'm starting to think both turbos have let go and the blades have gone into the valves directly inline with them, ie cylinders 2 and 5


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## Natbrat300 (Mar 6, 2012)

Check the exhaust camshaft and also look at the valves, you may find that one of them in cylinders 2 and 5 is not touching the cam.


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

What would have suddenly caused that? Some kind of debris/turbine blade jamming a valve open?


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## Natbrat300 (Mar 6, 2012)

Yep!


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

And I'm looking for a gap between the cams and the buckets?


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## Natbrat300 (Mar 6, 2012)

Yep!


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Ok so the valve lifters seem to follow the cams correctly, ie when the cam is "off lift" the lifters come all the way back up...


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## Natbrat300 (Mar 6, 2012)

It is very hard to assist with a diagnosis over the internet, but if your happy that everything you have done so far is correct, then I think it is time to start looking for a garage near to you which is able to rebuild / swap your engine, if that's what turns out to be needed.


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

There's no garages over here happy to do the work. My last rebuild seemed to last 3 years so may have to do the old home engine build again haha. I'm fairly convinced the turbos have shat themselves. I might try and stick a bore scope up the downpipe


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## Endlessr32 (Mar 9, 2014)

Sounds like the cas to me mate, had the same thing happen to me, the cas had worked a bit loose and slightly moved in position, repositioned it and tightened it up and it was all fine then


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Triple checked the cas dude and refitted. Also wouldn't explain the loss of compression?


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## Endlessr32 (Mar 9, 2014)

Oh I see mate, no sorry mine was fine once I had adjusted the cas, lack of compression is not a good sign bud


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Just stuck a bore scope up the exhaust to the front turbine and.... It looks fine!!???


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Do the turbines ever partially fail? As in the inducer part of the turbine? Because the exducer looks fine.


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## Endlessr32 (Mar 9, 2014)

No too sure about that mate, when my turbo died it was the oil seals that went so it just smoked like crazy


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## Smiffy415 (Jan 15, 2014)

Definitely pop the bore scope down the plug holes on cylinders 2 and 5 while you've got it.


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## 8ren (Apr 17, 2008)

CabbageMS said:


> Do the turbines ever partially fail? As in the inducer part of the turbine? Because the exducer looks fine.


I would say this is unlikely to be your problem. If an engine looses compression on cylinders (unless its all of them) while running it would probably run very badly but usually keep running.
If your car suddenly died and would not re start, my first guess would be electrical. However if you have odd compression readings and have had a cam belt change, has your cam belt skipped? (A lot!)


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## 8ren (Apr 17, 2008)

Smiffy415 said:


> Definitely pop the bore scope down the plug holes on cylinders 2 and 5 while you've got it.


Agree :thumbsup:


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

As soon as I get daylight I'll check the bores although I had a quick look at the top of piston 2 tonight and all looked healthy. Didn't get a decent look at the bore walls though. 

Yeah it instantly cut out and shows no sign of restarting. It'd be a dream if it was just an electrical problem. Spark did look orangey yellow and not blue. Cambelt looks like it's near to bang on but I might take it off and just refit it. 

I guess if any turbo is going to let go it'd normally be the back one first right?


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Just put oil down bores to see if it helped with compression and it didn't do anything in the cylinders with no compression and increased the compression in cylinders with some compression by 10-15 psi


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## Natbrat300 (Mar 6, 2012)

What were the words famously used by Henry 8th?


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## Smiffy415 (Jan 15, 2014)

Natbrat300 said:


> What were the words famously used by Henry 8th?



Yep, off with her head to see what's damaged the valves/seats or pistons if you're unlucky .


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

So looks like it wasn't the turbines... Next step is get the back turbo off and then take the head off. Anyone know of any guides for getting the head off with engine in situ?


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Just checked the whole turbine wheel and it's intact. 

I'm utterly confused as to how compression could have gone two zero on cylinders 2 and 5 so randomly... boost was standard with restrictor, fuelling was fine, no det... Odd 

Car is in shed and I'm ready to start taking the engine out to take the head off but I really hate starting a job this big when I don't have any clear sign of what's failed


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Rear turbo damage...


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## CabbageMS (Feb 8, 2011)

Head is off... Bores are knackered as is cylinder head!


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## Natbrat300 (Mar 6, 2012)

Photos please!



CabbageMS said:


> Head is off... Bores are knackered as is cylinder head!


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