# OS Giken power limits



## johnhanton57 (May 2, 2009)

SVM informed me today that OS Giken recon my car is too powerful for their LSD. 

They did not however say what their LSD is good for so if I were you I would stay away from them if your over 900 BHP. 

Now they have the right to come back on the forum and say that their product is good for less or perhaps more but it would be good before you all spend your hard earn with them that they give you a specification which is more than I got.

Well Done OS Giken first class customer service :clap::clap::clap::bawling:


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## enshiu (Aug 20, 2010)

After all the hassle. Good news.


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## Adamantium (Jun 24, 2002)

Did you get your money back?

Personally I don't think you can complain about not having a specification from them before you buy. No one held a gun to your head and made you buy it without a specification.


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## [email protected] (Nov 16, 2010)

enshiu said:


> After all the hassle. Good news.


Enshiu WTF !
How is this good News? 
kk


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## mindlessoath (Nov 30, 2007)

good news to know the limit of the product

and that we can finally move on and choose stock and or get a new product for those power levels.


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## [email protected] (Nov 16, 2010)

Adamantium said:


> Did you get your money back?
> 
> Personally I don't think you can complain about not having a specification from them before you buy. No one held a gun to your head and made you buy it without a specification.


 NO money back 

I for one think this is a disgrace

A manufacturer of a Motor sport product like OS Giken, should state what the limitations of use are ! 

You/we purchase on an understanding. it will be an improvement on OEM in this case I'm not so sure 

Say if I state an SVM clutch will stand 1400bhp (it will) or our exhaust will be track Legal (they will be) If they are not up to the job so to speak,

Then money will be Returned. Isn't this right and the way it should be ?

We can not surly live with, you pay your money and you end up with more issues than you might have done and it is for the consumer that takes his or her chance , think about it why else would we even consider a "motor sport Item"



I totally understand this item has been pushed,"there is a level of risk" it is very annoying in this situation, the OEM drive shafts, OEM crown wheel and OEM half shafts ALL SURVIVED and the only modified part in the diff unit broke! 

What I would like to see is for OS Giken to now state the limitations of use,and to what level of risk the supplier or end user has to take on! Maybe there is more grip and No extra strengh? If so, then it should be stated on ther product!Taking my "manufacturer hat off, for a moment, Now as a supplier, we will sought JH out

(as a company we take responsibility serious) We have asked for help, in a correct manor, unfortunately help has not materialised The Diff will now be replaced and the OS Giken Scrapped

RB has been very kind to state they would supply at cost(same again) or OS Giken would try and Improve on the Unit *at a cost of nearly 5k*, however reiterating still no guarantee it would hold



To me that's like saying, buy this tyre and it's good for very high speed, and is better than fitted, your OEMs were ok for 197mph, so you buy 

The tyre explodes at 210mph , is it your fault, because you were doing the speed? Now the Manufacturer said No worries buy this one, and have another go , but we cant promise Lol

Have we made the most Powerful GTR in the world using this Product ? 

I think we need to know, Just think on ,what if it were your money!


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## MattGTR750 (Apr 26, 2012)

F**K OS GIKEN hope you get your money back!


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## MIKEGTR (Jul 8, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> Enshiu WTF !
> How is this good News?
> kk


Ignore him Kev he has tooth in brain


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## alex_123_fra (Mar 26, 2008)

It is unfortunate that you didn't get your money back but if OS Giken had obliged, I suspect that would have put them at considerable risk. If I were them, I would have paid back just out of goodwill towards the customer.

Not entirely sure many companies will be guaranteeing their parts (diff, clutch or otherwise) against failure at 1000+ hp. They may say we "rate this product up to x level of torque". There is still a comparatively high change of failure purely due to the forces involved and that is not even getting into the argument about what constitutes abuse of a setup or part. Even if a spec existed and you took them to court, they would still argue around your use of the setup (Adam will of course know much more about this).

Without meaning to sound heartless, if I were spending so much on an enormous level of modification, I wouldn't expect any money back if something broke unless it came with a very specific warranty and I had a legitimate claim. The reality is, stuff just has a high chance of breaking at such levels of tune. The fact that OEM parts remained fine in this case is irrelevant and purely chance.


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## johnhanton57 (May 2, 2009)

quite clearly OS Giken is good for* 20 BHP and 20 lb ft. * They are for sure good for this but if you want to push more beware. Normally a company would challenge my figires but as OS Giken don't publish any numbers mine are just as good as their lack of numbers,

So unless challenged 20 bhp and 20 lbs ft in an R-35 is all you should expect. Of course i could be wrong and OS Giken will correct me with REAL numbers before you ALL WASTE YOUR CASH on a NAME!


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## johnhanton57 (May 2, 2009)

Adamantium said:


> Did you get your money back?
> 
> Personally I don't think you can complain about not having a specification from them before you buy. No one held a gun to your head and made you buy it without a specification.


No money just **** off no specifications just BS.....dont buy please:bawling:


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## johnhanton57 (May 2, 2009)

enshiu said:


> After all the hassle. Good news.


Great news the Japs ran away and deserted their product


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## johnhanton57 (May 2, 2009)

mindlessoath said:


> good news to know the limit of the product
> 
> and that we can finally move on and choose stock and or get a new product for those power levels.


Stay with stock and don't waste your cash


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## johnhanton57 (May 2, 2009)

MattGTR750 said:


> F**K OS GIKEN hope you get your money back!


NO CHANCE!


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## johnhanton57 (May 2, 2009)

alex_123_fra said:


> It is unfortunate that you didn't get your money back but if OS Giken had obliged, I suspect that would have put them at considerable risk. If I were them, I would have paid back just out of goodwill towards the customer.
> 
> Not entirely sure many companies will be guaranteeing their parts (diff, clutch or otherwise) against failure at 1000+ hp. They may say we "rate this product up to x level of torque". There is still a comparatively high change of failure purely due to the forces involved and that is not even getting into the argument about what constitutes abuse of a setup or part. Even if a spec existed and you took them to court, they would still argue around your use of the setup (Adam will of course know much more about this).
> 
> Without meaning to sound heartless, if I were spending so much on an enormous level of modification, I wouldn't expect any money back if something broke unless it came with a very specific warranty and I had a legitimate claim. The reality is, stuff just has a high chance of breaking at such levels of tune. The fact that OEM parts remained fine in this case is irrelevant and purely chance.


Totally agree OS Giken has no right selling LSD as an upgrade. Beware the buyer as the seller does not CARE!

OS Giken thinks it can sell an UPGRADE without specifications .........oh the shock that is coming should be interesting.


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## mindlessoath (Nov 30, 2007)

tell your story here: Jalopnik - Drive Free or Die
they have a long standing record of making auto places change their mind on things. but be professional and calm about it, otherwise they wont put up spam and annoying stuff.


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## enshiu (Aug 20, 2010)

[email protected] said:


> Enshiu WTF !
> How is this good News?
> kk


I thought he had the money back. Apologise for the reaction.

Oh my ..... No money back from OS Giken??!!!

What is the power limit of this LSD then? 1000hp?

Mike shut it you ignorance ....... .I thought he had the money back.


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## R390LM (Mar 7, 2010)

enshiu said:


> After all the hassle. Good news.


Dude, quit with the engrish potato.


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## Adam Kindness (Jun 22, 2002)

The diff is an upgrade... it provides more grip/different locking characteristics and is adjustable (X spec)

To say its not an upgrade because it broke with something like 1400bhp is a bit :S are there many running at this power with stock or OS rear diffs?

PS - I saw you in union square a few weeks back but you were passed by the time I remembered who you were


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## Adamantium (Jun 24, 2002)

johnhanton57 said:


> Totally agree OS Giken has no right selling LSD as an upgrade. Beware the buyer as the seller does not CARE!
> 
> OS Giken thinks it can sell an UPGRADE without specifications .........oh the shock that is coming should be interesting.


John,

You keep making this point but I still blink your logic is flawed. It might ave withstood 700bhp, so would still be rated for higher power levels than the stock power output. It doesn't mean that stock component would immediately fail in the same position.

You don't know how long the stock component you replaced would have lasted.

There coud have been a slow failure inside grain structure of the stock component that appears to be lasting whie it's actually building up to a catastrophic failure whereas a higher carbon content steel in the OS giken has just suddenly let go.

It doesn't mean it's not an upgrade, it could still be stronger than stock, you just haven't done a sufficient comparison of both components to really know. 

On top of that, as I said before, if you didn't actually know what it was rated to, why did you risk buying it, especially when the stock component hadn't shown signs of breaking.

I keep coming back to one point, yours hadn't failed when you "upgraded" ad you don't know what power you have run in the past or are running now,or you could have spiked to during over boost, pr the load the thing would have to withstand the nex time the tyres suddenly bite.

With that in mind, if you've had no failure in the past, then at sone point in the future, should this opponent have failed you'd be saying the same thing. At what power/torque level are you going to accept that it might have limitations?

Would you have forgiven OS Giken if you'd turned up the boost by 0.1 psi and then it failed?


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## [email protected] (Nov 16, 2010)

alex_123_fra said:


> It is unfortunate that you didn't get your money back but if OS Giken had obliged, I suspect that would have put them at considerable risk. If I were them, I would have paid back just out of goodwill towards the customer.
> 
> Not entirely sure many companies will be guaranteeing their parts (diff, clutch or otherwise) against failure at 1000+ hp. They may say we "rate this product up to x level of torque". There is still a comparatively high change of failure purely due to the forces involved and that is not even getting into the argument about what constitutes abuse of a setup or part. Even if a spec existed and you took them to court, they would still argue around your use of the setup (Adam will of course know much more about this).
> 
> Without meaning to sound heartless, if I were spending so much on an enormous level of modification, I wouldn't expect any money back if something broke unless it came with a very specific warranty and I had a legitimate claim. The reality is, stuff just has a high chance of breaking at such levels of tune. The fact that OEM parts remained fine in this case is irrelevant and purely chance.


Re posted on this thread to make the point kk

The diff failed on John's high powered GTR, However how much of that "power" was transmitted threw the rear diff at the time it let go?

Looking at the logs, he had zero waste gate duty in first gear (reducing power) he launched at 4500rpm (many have done so) his sixty foot time was only 1.6 at best, suggesting the car never really hooked up using and was not using any where near his potential engines power. The inertia wouldn't of been much greater than 1000s of full weight GTRs in the past, John you must try harder Lol 

So why did it shred the splines,inside the diff, and the drive shafts splines were untouched? If he was catapulting off at warp speed say 1.5sec or below,maybe that may have been justification?

The slow 60ft points to a fault with that diff, I cant understand why OS Giken wouldn't want to work on this and improve there product John and others could test, isn't this an opportunity to move the game forward for all parties concerned

As it stands any R35 trying to better johns launch technique stands a high chance the same will happen.



The diff was purchased in good faith,to hopefully improve from OEM,nothing ventured nothing gained, unfortunately it turned out to be wasted time and money



kk


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## Thrust (Jun 8, 2004)

Which OS diff was it?


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## johnhanton57 (May 2, 2009)

Thrust said:


> Which OS diff was it?


It's the one made from BUTTER


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## PS30-SB (Jun 13, 2003)

johnhanton57 said:


> Great news the Japs ran away and deserted their product


And this is from an "Executive Member" of the GTROC ....?

You're a total embarrassment.


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## Adam Kindness (Jun 22, 2002)

Thrust - X Spec i think


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## Thrust (Jun 8, 2004)

Thanks Adam. Just in case none of this has reached OS Giken's ears, I am getting mentally prepared to go and talk to their boss here. 

I don't want to think that this has been spread all over the internet before they have even heard about it. 

And I also don't want to get involved until we know how far up the chain what exactly has been said and to whom. If necessary I can then move.


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## enshiu (Aug 20, 2010)

PS30-SB said:


> And this is from an "Executive Member" of the GTROC ....?
> 
> You're a total embarrassment.


Sorry for the failure John and that you didn't got your money back. 

I can't believe a Jap. company does this to you. 

After all these years all the Jap. aftermarket tuners I have known were not like this. 

Or are they behind the scenes researching why it breaks like always??

If you need me with writing an email or letter to OS Giken I can do it right away.

Yes I haven't read it thoroughly before but, why are they denying the warranty claim?

Apologise for the reactions before as I was working and reading together:bowdown1:.


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## CT17 (Mar 25, 2011)

Sorry to say this, but many of the posts and responses by the person who had the diff fitted are rather childish.

OK, you spend a fortune on the car with huge levels of power.
OK, SVM fitted a part with no actual warranty or specified acceptable power output for you that failed.
OK, you seem to be upset about it.

Now do you really need to spam the forum with posts and threads about it that make you look like a spoiled child?

Yes, I would also be upset too. But I wouldn't be on here making myself look like a tit.
You are a grown man FFS.


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## johnhanton57 (May 2, 2009)

enshiu said:


> Sorry for the failure John and that you didn't got your money back.
> 
> I can't believe a Jap. company does this to you.
> 
> ...



No worries mate I'll get over it.

KK pretty much summed up what happened in his post.



Re posted on this thread to make the point kk

The diff failed on John's high powered GTR, However how much of that "power" was transmitted threw the rear diff at the time it let go?

Looking at the logs, he had zero waste gate duty in first gear (reducing power) he launched at 4500rpm (many have done so) his sixty foot time was only 1.6 at best, suggesting the car never really hooked up using and was not using any where near his potential engines power. The inertia wouldn't of been much greater than 1000s of full weight GTRs in the past, John you must try harder Lol 

So why did it shred the splines,inside the diff, and the drive shafts splines were untouched? If he was catapulting off at warp speed say 1.5sec or below,maybe that may have been justification?

The slow 60ft points to a fault with that diff, I cant understand why OS Giken wouldn't want to work on this and improve there product John and others could test, isn't this an opportunity to move the game forward for all parties concerned

As it stands any R35 trying to better johns launch technique stands a high chance the same will happen.



The diff was purchased in good faith,to hopefully improve from OEM,nothing ventured nothing gained, unfortunately it turned out to be wasted time and money



kk
__________________
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## SamboGrove (Jun 27, 2010)

CT17 said:


> Sorry to say this, but many of the posts and responses by the person who had the diff fitted are rather childish.
> 
> OK, you spend a fortune on the car with huge levels of power.
> OK, SVM fitted a part with no actual warranty or specified acceptable power output for you that failed.
> ...


well said that man.


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## Mookistar (Feb 5, 2004)

johnhanton57 said:


> The diff was purchased in good *faith*,to *hopefully* improve from OEM,nothing ventured nothing gained, unfortunately it turned out to be wasted time and money


You can't tune a car on Faith and Hope I'm afraid dude.

Mook


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## enshiu (Aug 20, 2010)

Many thanks John.



Mookistar said:


> You can't tune a car on Faith and Hope I'm afraid dude.
> 
> Mook





CT17 said:


> Sorry to say this, but many of the posts and responses by the person who had the diff fitted are rather childish.
> 
> OK, you spend a fortune on the car with huge levels of power.
> OK, SVM fitted a part with no actual warranty or specified acceptable power output for you that failed.
> ...


+100000


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## matt j (Oct 19, 2001)

Mookistar said:


> You can't tune a car on Faith and Hope I'm afraid dude.


Is following an industry experts recommendation in good faith the same though Mook?


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## mindlessoath (Nov 30, 2007)

this diff could have seen wheel hop prior to this last run. if that was the case, it would only take a small give from all the punishment it took before. wheel hop is a killer and to claim that it wasnt wheel hop is ignorant. without proper assessment with data and facts, we will never know. for you to say that diff has never seen wheel hop prior, id have a hard time believing that. im just saying... that may have been a factor, not that it is the cause.

lets just say added stresses will cause fatigue, when it builds up and builds up it will suddenly give even on slight runs and you will be left puzzled like in this case. i can see that as the reason being of what happened here.

being that this is the ONLY case thus far, we wont know entirely for sure. but i think i make a very solid case here, and i think its hard to argue otherwise. their may be more to it than just that... i agree with that too, so im not saying your incorrect at the fact it couldn't handle your massive power.





next off, you need to ask OSG if they will make a diff that can handle that power to 2k whp and offer that as a new product, even tho you will never ever go with OSG again because of your problems with them in more than one way (i believe it was handled poorly possibly on both ends).


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## mindlessoath (Nov 30, 2007)

also, IF these were available at the time... would your diff had been better off or not?
The Driveshaft Shop | R35 Rear axle Stubs for the GTR (For NI66 Kit) - Featured Products

from the data you have thus far, from what you say, the stock axels stubs were fine and the diff splines were damaged. could the differences between stock stubs and these DSS stubs make the damage worse or possibly have saved it?

honestly its too hard to tell at this point. i still agree that wheel hop is the main contributor to damage. this goes with track prep etc. the break may have happened on that last run, but the damage could have been occurring UP to that point from prior runs.

All i can say is at least your Diff casing didn't crack which is happening more and more often... get cracking on a rear billet diff casing.


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## matty32 (Dec 18, 2005)

PS30-SB said:


> And this is from an "Executive Member" of the GTROC ....?
> 
> You're a total embarrassment.



you really think that OS will release a product that does not match up to what they claim it will do. This is not the Japanese way.

i very much doubt that it will handle the power output that you seem to have reached. What is it rated too?

i am sure that OS (if it failed within their limits) would honor a warranty - depending on where you bought it.

They are a very good company, and support their products - to be fair as do all japanese companies.

& before anyone says it, no i am not an Os dealer

Things fail when you push them over the absolute limit

if you are a representative of GTROC, grow up or alternatively take the exact same stance and talk to them at the TAS if you are going.


i also seem my original thread of asking where you purchased the LSD has been edited.

i assume not from an authorised dealer.

most warranties are depending on the type of use

ie race only, or only limited to Japan unless bought via an authorised dealer

saying "bought in good faith" is a little lean.

anyway

best of luck.


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## paulock (Dec 1, 2012)

i think he got the product from rb MOTORSPORT ??


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## matty32 (Dec 18, 2005)

paulock said:


> i think he got the product from rb MOTORSPORT ??


If it is, then they are an authorised dealer 

i would want to know what the power output is quoted to

if within limits then surely you have a claim, however i doubt that anyone has pushed it that far


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## mindlessoath (Nov 30, 2007)

they probably bought the LSD because of the few 1000whp gtr's that were using it and getting a performance advantage from them on the dragstip. but those were only 1000whp give or take. hing's gtr ran a mid 8 sec down the 1/4mile. no issues. broke a few axels tho. he was no more than 1100whp. they also used launch control 1, but also had amazing suspension, tire/wheel combo too, as well as fully built trans with dodson parts.

when osg came out with this part it was designed and tested on a race track and not a drag strip, neither of them at these power levels.

the weak point of this car is the trans... no matter how much aftermarket parts you put in it, somethings going to break... wheel hop will break oem and aftermarket parts, nothing you can do but fix that by tuning and choosing the right parts to limit wheel hop.

also designing parts to work with each other. when the lsd was installed did it look like everything would line up correctly or any issues? some tuners have alot to say about parts and examine and R&D before using the parts. i know svm by there track record, may have overlooked that aspec (sorry guys, low blow, but being honest, no hard feelings ok, i truly want to see your builds belting out records and improving).


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## R390LM (Mar 7, 2010)

Mookistar said:


> You can't tune a car on Faith and Hope I'm afraid dude.
> 
> Mook


It worked for Saab ? right ? 











Oh wait, right.


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## Thrust (Jun 8, 2004)

Quote, mindlessoath: "when osg came out with this part it was designed and tested on a race track and not a drag strip, neither of them at these power levels."

This is what I was thinking. Surely this part is more for gaining corner speed on a racing circuit?


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## enshiu (Aug 20, 2010)

Thrust said:


> Quote, mindlessoath: "when osg came out with this part it was designed and tested on a race track and not a drag strip, neither of them at these power levels."
> 
> This is what I was thinking. Surely this part is more for gaining corner speed on a racing circuit?


Yes, agree completely. No one has ever thought it could handle 1500hp without breaking. Like Mindlessoath said. There something going to break if you push it this far beyond anyones imagination.


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## Adam Kindness (Jun 22, 2002)

this is exactly what i have been saying.

It is an UPGRADE... in the fashion that it has better lockup/grip, NOT that its stronger.


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## Russs (Oct 19, 2004)

paulock said:


> i think he got the product from rb MOTORSPORT ??


And I think you'll find that they weren't asked about the strength of the diff, they were just asked to supply it.


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## johnhanton57 (May 2, 2009)

*Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to you all*

Rant over time to move on. 

Hope you all have a great Christmas and see you at the track in the New Year


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## Ryan.g (Jul 27, 2007)

Just to let you know last night a car in dubai broke its Giken diff and would have put the car in a spin at 200kph if the Syvecs didn't see the inside rear wheel speed shoot up. Seriously scary!


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## Ryan.g (Jul 27, 2007)

It was making around 1400whp though 

But.... never seen a stock one do this. Will get some pics


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## MGT Motorsport Ltd (Aug 19, 2005)

Ryan.g said:


> It was making around 1400whp though
> 
> But.... never seen a stock one do this. Will get some pics





Hi Ryan 


Were you in the car at the time it broke:nervous: I don't think I would like to have been in that car when that happened.



Regards mark


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## Ryan.g (Jul 27, 2007)

No, luckily it was on a private strip aswell


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## johnhanton57 (May 2, 2009)

No real shock in this story:bawling:


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