# Can I afford a GTR?



## greenfly (Apr 3, 2014)

Just sold the M3 and bought a flat, always wanted a R35 GTR so starting to read up and look for one, but first I want to know if i will be able to afford one.

Right lets talk money, I have just over £30k to spend on the car. For that am I getting a dog? I was thinking to waiting until next year to save abit more and see where prices our at. Have prices bottomed out now, do you think they will go much below the £30k mark?

Running costs, few questions:

1. How much to fill a tank, how many miles out of it?
2. Servicing from a indy, how much should i expect to spend?
3. Tyres, how much a corner?

I am putting aside £300 a month for the car to run it(when i have one), it will be a weekend toy. Do you think that will be enough for servicing and tyres etc? I am looking to keep the car a year.

Thanks for any comments and advice guys!:bowdown1:


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## Conrad (Jul 29, 2004)

Some info for a guy in a similar situation, £30k wont get you much.

http://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/252241-r35-gt-r-wanted.html


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## TREG (May 20, 2004)

This may also help?


http://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/252089-r35-price.html


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## greenfly (Apr 3, 2014)

Cheers!


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## NELLEE (Mar 8, 2014)

greenfly said:


> Just sold the M3 and bought a flat, always wanted a R35 GTR so starting to read up and look for one, but first I want to know if i will be able to afford one.
> 
> Right lets talk money, I have just over £30k to spend on the car. For that am I getting a dog? I was thinking to waiting until next year to save abit more and see where prices our at. Have prices bottomed out now, do you think they will go much below the £30k mark?
> 
> ...


If your lucky enough to find a car with newish brakes and tyres, and only do 2-3k in the year you own it, them maybe it shouldnt cost you that much.. 

Not sure i would want to own a GTR if i was worried about MPG and stuck to a monthly budget, what if things break


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## vxrcymru (Sep 29, 2009)

35K + for a decent example - A 30k car will be a very high miler and probably need breaks and tyres

Tyres 1300 a set and will last 8-10k road miles 

Pads and discs 2k-4k a full set depending on quality - road use should last a good 20k miles. 

14-22mpg on the road depends how you drive

Tax - top bracket 400 ish 

Insurance - get a quote


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## stixGTR (Sep 24, 2013)

Without sounding rude, if you're asking the question the answer is probably no. 

I bought mine with the same intention as yourself. Keep it for a year ...use at weekends.... etc etc

If you get one.... and have the breaking strain of a soggy kit kat like me ... you'll struggle to keep yourself out of it..... but every time you bury the loud pedal you forget all about running costs.


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## JasonNT (May 17, 2012)

stixGTR said:


> ..... but every time you bury the loud pedal you forget all about running costs.


+1 keep finding i take 200 mile round trips to get some milk:clap:


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## stixGTR (Sep 24, 2013)

JasonNT said:


> +1 keep finding i take 200 mile round trips to get some milk:clap:


I'll second that :thumbsup:


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## CT17 (Mar 25, 2011)

greenfly said:


> Right lets talk money, I have just over £30k to spend on the car. For that am I getting a dog? I was thinking to waiting until next year to save abit more and see where prices our at. Have prices bottomed out now, do you think they will go much below the £30k mark?
> 
> Running costs, few questions:
> 
> ...


£30k is not enough for a decent car currently.
You need to be aiming for £35-37k in my opinion.

1. About £80. You'll average about 18mpg unless you hoon it everywhere, then maybe 12mpg...
2. I'd budget £600 per year to cover basic servicing..
3. £300 per corner for non-runflats. Almost double that for the correct runflats.

If it needs brakes or any other work £300 won't do it.
You might be able to scrape by on that. But any faults could torpedo your budget, so I'd be wary.


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## DWC (May 18, 2009)

£300 PLUS Fuel I hope. You could easily put £300 a month Fuel in just on Weekend Blast's as a toy. I do !


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## Trevgtr (Dec 24, 2012)

Jesus, sometimes I spend more than 300 quid in a week on petrol  but on average I fill it up twice a week at around 80 quid a shot, which delivers about 200 miles per fill up.

I do 20k miles per year in my GTR and I reckon the total cost of running my car is around £1 per mile all in.


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## smoggy12345 (Aug 4, 2013)

Just a question, if it's not too intrusive?

I'm in a similiar situation to the OP and just wondered what sort of wage you guys earn and what sort of outgoings you have and still manage to own & run a GT-R?

I'm currently earning about £70 - £75k per annum = about £3,700 p/m after tax and deductions 

My outgoings = about £2000 p/m (inclusive of loans for the car) at the moment but If I have a child will probs rise to around £3200 p/m worst case if my partner can't work. These outgoings don't include food/entertainment.

Only looking at a UK 09 GT-R for around £35-38k 

Would only look to service once a year as will only do 4-5k miles per year in it

Would you say its viable for me to run a Nissan GT-R?

Cheers,

Dean

P.S. sorry to hijack thread


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## bobbie (Jan 3, 2013)

car tax is £500 just gone up 

Bobby


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## AnEvoGuy (Aug 17, 2011)

If you don't have a contingency fund, £300 a month just wouldn't be enough to run a car. If something needs replacing then you would struggle to pay for it.


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## simon tompkins (Aug 14, 2005)

i think you should think long and hard before you buy one.as it sounds like you will get into deep water very quickly,these cars require a good amount of money spent on them,thats why there are so many secondhand cars on the market,people buy them and then get caught out by the very high running costs.a gtr will make your running costs of your m3 look like servicing a fiesta cost wise.

that said a brilliant car.


simon


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## Firestarter (Mar 8, 2014)

simon tompkins said:


> i think you should think long and hard before you buy one.as it sounds like you will get into deep water very quickly,these cars require a good amount of money spent on them,thats why there are so many secondhand cars on the market,people buy them and then get caught out by the very high running costs.a gtr will make your running costs of your m3 look like servicing a fiesta cost wise.
> 
> that said a brilliant car.
> 
> ...


+1

I stick £350 pm away as the sludge fund, however you could purchase a warranty on the car. Litchfield do one and having discussed in depth with Kev & Amar @ SVM they will also be looking to do the same once they have the stonking new premises up and running.:bowdown1::bowdown1::bowdown1:

I came from an RS4 to the GTR and yes its more expensive to run, but if I'm being honest if you have to go down to "how much" all the time then its not for you. The car will deliver a fantastic experience, but it comes at a price. As a guide I Paid 37.5k for my Dec 2009 Black Edition with 21k mikes and 2 previous owners. I bought it in April and have done 5360k mikes to date and spent in excess of 8k modding it.
With regards to fuel I log every fill up using a free app and have spent £1643.84 with an average MPG of 20.36. The worst being 11.89 and the best being 27.6.

HTH

Cheers
Louie


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## Rainman (May 9, 2014)

I thought I contribute to this thread since this is something I'm going through right now and just about to take delivery of my GT-R later this week if all goes well.

I know this thread is a few months old now, and maybe the OP isn't tracking this any more and been put off the idea completely, but what everyone so far seems to have ignored that the cost of ownership is largely down to the mileage you're likely to do.

From what I've seen a £30K budget won't even going to get into a GT-R, at least not one that would reflect a sensible purchase. The guide prices indicate that you might be able to find an '09 with 50K miles from an independent for £30K, but if you look on autotrader you won't find many under £35K. At the time of writing there's a CAT D '09 car on there for £32K, so that should tell you what £30K will get you in todays market. If I managed to dump £30K on a used GT-R I don't think that I would be sleeping too well at night.

I was initially attracted to the prospect of GT-R ownership by seeing '09 cars up for sale in the £35K region, but after a lot of research I came to realise that for my own peace of mind I would need to spend more on a slightly newer car and had to revise my purchasing budget significantly.

Leaving the initial purchase aside, the OP has been running an M3. Which one I don't know, and for how long is anyone's guess. Depending on the year of M3, the chances are that the running costs of an M3 aren't going to be wildly different. You might not chew through tyres as quick, and they may be a little cheaper, same goes for pads, and the fuel economy isn't going to be wildly different. I'd say if you can run an M3 and you're not skint at the end of every month then the chances are you could run a GT-R, but expect some larger bills. If you're skint running the M3 then forget it.

Personally, I've been running a 370Z since December last year and in the 8 months I've done 10K miles. It's cost me a complete set of tyres at around £1000, a full set of pads at £250, and a bit over £3000 in fuel and I think £250-ish for 6 months tax. So for the last 8 months I'm in the hole for over £4500 before it's even been serviced. I've just recently had a change of job and so I'm now commuting into London on a 50 mile daily round trip on a motorbike, so when I get my GT-R it's annual mileage isn't going to huge. Whilst it will be my main car it will only get driven evenings and weekends. I'd be surprised if I do 5000 miles a year, but you never know - like a lot of other people on here I'm also partial to finding any excuse to go out and convert dead dinosaurs into smoke and noise. We're always well stocked with milk and bread in our house. :chuckle:

As for servicing, I've had a good look at what Litchfields charge for servicing and I have to say that I think it's very reasonable, but obviously you need to do it a bit more frequently. I've owned various Lotus Elise versions, Noble M12 GTO3, 350Z, 370Z and next week I hope to take ownership of a GT-R. All of those previous cars have landed me with £1000+ annual service bills on top of tyres and pads at some time or another, heck I even had a Ford Mondeo ST24 (piece of crap) which was worse on fuel than my 370Z, destroyed front tyres as quick as you'd look at them, and would still cost me a packet to service it. My feelings on GT-R servicing is that if you're used to maintaining any car with a hint of performance then the GT-R isn't so different until you start talking about tyres - but then that is all down to the mileage you do and the way you drive. My wife is horrified that I need at least 1 set of tyres and pads on my cars every year when hers all last for twice as long.

Insurance is a consideration - The M3 is a little cheaper than my 370Z to insure, and the cost of the annual policy for myself on a GT-R is about £50 a year more than I pay now. I seem to recall that on one insurer the 370Z is group 47, and the GT-R is group 50. I'm 44, live inside the M25 with an SP30 and one claim a year ago and the meerkat is giving me quotes from £675 with Admiral upwards.

I'm under no illusions and the GT-R is definitely going to cost me more per-mile, but I'm doing less miles now so at the end of each year I don't think I'll be any worse off. Looking at it I wouldn't say the GT-R is necessarily any more expensive to maintain than any other performance car, with one or two exceptions than are really dictated by your annual mileage and how you drive the thing.

Phil


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## TREG (May 20, 2004)

smoggy12345 said:


> Just a question, if it's not too intrusive?
> 
> I'm in a similiar situation to the OP and just wondered what sort of wage you guys earn and what sort of outgoings you have and still manage to own & run a GT-R?
> 
> ...



On the mileage you are doing I would say you could do it. It may mean less dinners out but that's going to happen anyway if you have a little one on the way. Go for it


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## SPEEDKING777 (Jul 17, 2014)

I usually hate posts when people say if you have to ask then you probably can't afford it, but your questions are so specificity related to "£" ie, how much is a full fuel tank?

A £30k GTR tbh is going to be whack, I wouldn't even bother at all, your going to get hurt and its going to ruin your whole GTR experiance. Save some more money get a good example and then enjoy it.

But seriously with cars like these you can not be worrying about fuel. Thats like getting a Prius and asking what it's 0-60 time is. GTR's are made to go fast simple as that really MPG is not important, some days I spend £0 on fuel other days £200.

Bottom line is, if you actually want to enjoy a car you can't be worrying about how much fuel you need to put in or what your mile allowance is per day.

I put £1000 a month a side just for the car, for random things, it's more than I need to but then I prefer to not run in to trouble.


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## TREG (May 20, 2004)

SPEEDKING777 said:


> I put £1000 a month a side just for the car, for random things




Your earning too much money


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## SPEEDKING777 (Jul 17, 2014)

TREG said:


> Your earning too much money


Pfff I wish


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## Evo9lution (Aug 24, 2013)

There is possibly another way to purchase the car but I'm by no means suggesting that you should do this ...

Let's say that you wait until you have £35k saved and decide to buy a £35k car. Use £25k of your own money and get a £10k loan (not finance) over 5 years at a good rate (about 4%) and you'll be paying around £200 p/m (obviously, this will mean that you pay slightly more in the long run).

Now, what this gives you is the ability to save £100+ p/m towards servicing (which should be enough for the basics) or even a Litchfield or Middlehurst warranty but also gives you £10k just in case. Furthermore, if you get yourself a Santander 123 Current account, that £10k will earn you 3% interest as well (offset against the 4% loan but also consider the £100 p/m you can still save).

As said above, I'm not saying that you should do this but at least it gives you some wriggle room should something go. You may be a little worse off in the long run but not a huge amount. Also, should the worse happen, your LTV is ~30% of the cost of the car so you could always sell it and pocket the difference and then you'd not be much worse off (prices have pretty much stabilised for MY09/59 cars ...) as a pure purchase - obviously, fuel etc. will make some impact but that will be there regardless ...

Just food for thought :thumbsup:


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## Evo9lution (Aug 24, 2013)

The point I'm making above is that if you want to buy a car like a GTR, you probably always want to have at least £10k in disposable cash, just in case ...


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## SPEEDKING777 (Jul 17, 2014)

Evo9lution said:


> The point I'm making above is that if you want to buy a car like a GTR, you probably always want to have at least £10k in disposable cash, just in case ...


This for sure


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## Brad1979 (May 26, 2012)

Spot on great advice


Evo9lution said:


> There is possibly another way to purchase the car but I'm by no means suggesting that you should do this ...
> 
> Let's say that you wait until you have £35k saved and decide to buy a £35k car. Use £25k of your own money and get a £10k loan (not finance) over 5 years at a good rate (about 4%) and you'll be paying around £200 p/m (obviously, this will mean that you pay slightly more in the long run).
> 
> ...


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## Adamantium (Jun 24, 2002)

£10k disposable cash for what?

Granted my cars have been under warranty and I've spent £10ks on modifying them, but other than a punctured tyre, I've never needed to spend more than the cost of a service on it.

If you are so terrified, spend £100/month on a litchfield warranty, but personally to many even that is still overkill.


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## SPEEDKING777 (Jul 17, 2014)

The £10k is just a comfortable amount to have a side just in case a few things decide to give way at the same time. 

Even with my evo I have kept 5K a side, it's not that its needed but it's good to have it as a security.


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## Evo9lution (Aug 24, 2013)

Adamantium said:


> £10k disposable cash for what?
> 
> Granted my cars have been under warranty and I've spent £10ks on modifying them, but other than a punctured tyre, I've never needed to spend more than the cost of a service on it.
> 
> If you are so terrified, spend £100/month on a litchfield warranty, but personally to many even that is still overkill.


Not just for the car Adam, but if the worst were to happen and the OP were to lose his job, it gives him a few months wriggle room ... If it were only £3k or £5k, things could get tight very quickly and then you're possibly forced to sell your car cheap and quick ... The £10k is also for other things, like holidays etc. which, if one were to push themself too tight, may have to fall by the wayside.

And if one ended up in the unfortunate situation that new rotors, pads & tyres were needed all round in order to pass the MoT the cost would quickly escalate. £10k is a figure that should really cover the vast majority of worst case scenarios (at least IMO but everyone should do what they feel is correct :thumbsup


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## JohnE90M3 (May 31, 2010)

Adamantium said:


> £10k disposable cash for what?
> 
> Granted my cars have been under warranty and I've spent £10ks on modifying them, but other than a punctured tyre, I've never needed to spend more than the cost of a service on it.
> 
> If you are so terrified, spend £100/month on a litchfield warranty, but personally to many even that is still overkill.


Have to agree.
But the older the car the more chance of things needing doing, so looking again at the scenario of a £30K GTR, expense must be expected but £10K in holding Na IMO.


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## Adamantium (Jun 24, 2002)

Evo9lution said:


> Not just for the car Adam, but if the worst were to happen and the OP were to lose his job, it gives him a few months wriggle room ... If it were only £3k or £5k, things could get tight very quickly and then you're possibly forced to sell your car cheap and quick ... The £10k is also for other things, like holidays etc. which, if one were to push themself too tight, may have to fall by the wayside.
> 
> And if one ended up in the unfortunate situation that new rotors, pads & tyres were needed all round in order to pass the MoT the cost would quickly escalate. £10k is a figure that should really cover the vast majority of worst case scenarios (at least IMO but everyone should do what they feel is correct :thumbsup


That's fair enough, but then I don't think that's unique to this car. It would be the case with any car costing that amount.


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## Caveman (Apr 28, 2004)

I think the biggest cost to GTR ownership, which is inevitable, but does add hugely to the burden of ownership, is MODS!

The car screams out to be modified, and unless you spend no time on the internet and this forum, the temptation to mod, be it cosmetically or performance wise, is huge.

There is so much that can be done to the car to make it better, faster, noisier, lower, prettier etc.

You'll be fooling yourself if you think you won't mod it...


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## Mrw (Aug 22, 2012)

Caveman said:


> I think the biggest cost to GTR ownership, which is inevitable, but does add hugely to the burden of ownership, is MODS!
> 
> The car screams out to be modified, and unless you spend no time on the internet and this forum, the temptation to mod, be it cosmetically or performance wise, is huge.
> 
> ...


Very True :chuckle:


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## Evo9lution (Aug 24, 2013)

Adamantium said:


> That's fair enough, but then I don't think that's unique to this car. It would be the case with any car costing that amount.


That's exactly right. I only referred to the GTR specifically as that was what his question was about but the same would be true for any car. Everyone needs to decide for themself what they consider the safe margin to be and then budget for that.


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## snuffy (Mar 26, 2014)

Evo9lution said:


> Let's say that you wait until you have £35k saved and decide to buy a £35k car. Use £25k of your own money and get a £10k loan (not finance) over 5 years at a good rate (about 4%) and you'll be paying around £200 p/m (obviously, this will mean that you pay slightly more in the long run).


That's pretty much what I did. Mine was £47k and I've borrowed £15k over 2 years. The total interest (4.9%) over 2 years is £750, which I think is pretty good.


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## JohnE90M3 (May 31, 2010)

snuffy said:


> That's pretty much what I did. Mine was £47k and I've borrowed £15k over 2 years. The total interest (4.9%) over 2 years is £750, which I think is pretty good.


Yea but what was the monthly repayment?.


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## snuffy (Mar 26, 2014)

JohnE90M3 said:


> Yea but what was the monthly repayment?.


About £650 a month. But the point I was making is that it may be better to borrow some of the money for the car and that way you don't strap yourself.


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## JohnE90M3 (May 31, 2010)

snuffy said:


> About £650 a month. But the point I was making is that it may be better to borrow some of the money for the car and that way you don't strap yourself.


Fair Comment


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## TREG (May 20, 2004)

Evo9lution said:


> There is possibly another way to purchase the car but I'm by no means suggesting that you should do this ...
> 
> Let's say that you wait until you have £35k saved and decide to buy a £35k car. Use £25k of your own money and get a £10k loan (not finance) over 5 years at a good rate (about 4%) and you'll be paying around £200 p/m (obviously, this will mean that you pay slightly more in the long run).
> 
> ...




That's not far off what I done.

I paid most of the money out and then put £7k on an interest free credit card for 16 months. I cleared the payment within the 16 months so it became an interest free loan.
As long as you can keep on top of the monthly payments I would advise you to look in this direction:wavey:


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## Adamantium (Jun 24, 2002)

TREG said:


> That's not far off what I done.
> 
> I paid most of the money out and then put £7k on an interest free credit card for 16 months. I cleared the payment within the 16 months so it became an interest free loan.
> As long as you can keep on top of the monthly payments I would advise you to look in this direction:wavey:


Didn't that cost you 3% of the loan by way of balance transfer?


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## scoooby slayer (Jun 13, 2009)

borrowing money to buy a car is complete and utter madness imo, if you cant even afford to buy it with cash in the bank you cant afford it, I normally have a rule if I cant afford to buy it twice over then I cant afford it basically. 


borrow money to buy a house not a car imo !


we live in such a generation of debt its ridiculous imo, I was bought up old school and its stuck work hard, save hard and buy what you want and I now apply that to my business exactly the same plough some of the profit back in and grow the business, not just buy loads of equipment on credit and still be paying for it when its all worn out, no thanks !


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## Nickgtr35 (Aug 13, 2011)

TREG said:


> Your earning too much money


My11 from new,I reckon costs including depreciation are going to cost avg £10,000 to £12,000 per year based on 8,000 miles per year


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## JohnE90M3 (May 31, 2010)

scoooby slayer said:


> borrowing money to buy a car is complete and utter madness imo, if you cant even afford to buy it with cash in the bank you cant afford it, I normally have a rule if I cant afford to buy it twice over then I cant afford it basically.
> 
> 
> borrow money to buy a house not a car imo !
> ...


This is and has always been my way too, can't pay outright don't buy it.


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## simon tompkins (Aug 14, 2005)

thats a great ethos but i bet you, most have got finance on their cars.


simon


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## scoooby slayer (Jun 13, 2009)

simon tompkins said:


> thats a great ethos but i bet you, most have got finance on their cars.
> 
> 
> simon



more fool them imo, as my dad always told me "you cant spend what you havnt got" 

unfortunately nowadays that's exactly what everyone wants to do spend it before they've earnt it, complete and utter madness imo


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## AdnanK (Jun 11, 2013)

So, what we've learnt from this thread.

If you want to buy a used GTR 2009-2011, and you have less than £90k-£100k in the bank, you can't afford it


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## Evo9lution (Aug 24, 2013)

scoooby slayer said:


> borrowing money to buy a car is complete and utter madness imo, if you cant even afford to buy it with cash in the bank you cant afford it, I normally have a rule if I cant afford to buy it twice over then I cant afford it basically.
> 
> 
> borrow money to buy a house not a car imo !
> ...


That's a very prudent and valid comment. However, it doesn't always suit everyone; in much the same way as some people have mortgages and some people rent. The important thing is to make sure that you review your finances thoroughly and don't stretch yourself too tightly (and only ever get a loan that will be worth less than the value of the car should you sell it ...).

In reality, though this is a very controversial thing to say, there is very, very little difference between getting a loan on a house (mortgage) and getting a loan on a car. They're both objects that once the loan is paid off you will own outright; or sell for the equity if you decide to upgrade / need the cash early.

If one was discussing the pros & cons of spending money on a car OR a (first) home, then I agree completely that the house should take precedent. Otherwise, it's important to realise that they're just objects ... People don't seem to mind too much in getting a mortgage for a holiday home etc.

Also, a little bit of debt isn't necessarily a bad thing; again, if it's manageable. There are many very rich people who still get mortgages on a house even though they can afford to buy it outright. Why? Because it gives flexibility and this is what it's all about. It's about being prudent and as long as you're prudent, there is nothing saying that you cannot have your cake and eat it.


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## Evo9lution (Aug 24, 2013)

Finance is different to an unsecured personal loan. Personally, I would always be wary of that as it could cause issues should you ever need access to the money tied up in the car ...

Spiralling debt is indeed a huge issue. But just because someone gets a small loan for a car doesn't mean that they are foolish or going to end up in major financial issues. Do banks deal in debt - their own & others? Do governments deal in debt? Look at football clubs ... As long as they manage it correctly, it's fine. It's only when they over-step the mark that they have issues.


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## scoooby slayer (Jun 13, 2009)

Evo9lution said:


> That's a very prudent and valid comment. However, it doesn't always suit everyone; in much the same way as some people have mortgages and some people rent. The important thing is to make sure that you review your finances thoroughly and don't stretch yourself too tightly (and only ever get a loan that will be worth less than the value of the car should you sell it ...).
> 
> In reality, though this is a very controversial thing to say, there is very, very little difference between getting a loan on a house (mortgage) and getting a loan on a car. They're both objects that once the loan is paid off you will own outright; or sell for the equity if you decide to upgrade / need the cash early.
> 
> ...



we run 15 dozers/scrapers and I have been considering finance on a d6r with a ripper on as weve had a call or 2 for them recently and with some companys paying on 90 days cash flow can be an issue hence considering finance as we would need that flexibility, but that's a machine that will hire out and make over £1k a week profit.

we are simply talking about buying a weekend car a stock gtr that will depreciate and cost money to run and bring in no income whatsoever, I think its madness every bone in my body would tell me not to do it, especially if the bank funds can only just scrape the purchase price then theres not much surplus income its a no brainer to me


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## Evo9lution (Aug 24, 2013)

scoooby slayer said:


> we run 15 dozers/scrapers and I have been considering finance on a d6r with a ripper on as weve had a call or 2 for them recently and with some companys paying on 90 days cash flow can be an issue hence considering finance as we would need that flexibility, but that's a machine that will hire out and make over £1k a week profit.
> 
> we are simply talking about buying a weekend car a stock gtr that will depreciate and cost money to run and bring in no income whatsoever, I think its madness every bone in my body would tell me not to do it, especially if the bank funds can only just scrape the purchase price then theres not much surplus income its a no brainer to me


As I said, it's prudent not to take a loan but it's still eminently possible without being foolish. It's an option that people can utilise, that's all.

I would argue that it's less risky and has potentially infinitely better (long-term) outcome than paying rent for your home ... however, many, many people are in that situation & they're not called foolish. What about those that play the markets ...

The risk is a depreciating factor - the depreciation of the car (if you're prudent - again :chuckle should be slower than the rate that the loan reduces so the highest risk is straight away and short-term projection is easier to foresee ...

Anyway, to end this debate now as it's spamming the OP's thread a bit, you are right in what you say as an ideal but there are alternatives that people can consider and it's up to each individual to determine which route is best for them


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## simon tompkins (Aug 14, 2005)

i totally agree with you scooby slayer but i also agree with evo9lution,as you can't always save all the money for a car and not everyone owns their own business,where they have large incomes,some people have normal steady jobs and want and need a new car (or secondhand) but can't afford to save the 10-£15000 thousand it might cost,simply because they need the car straight away,(i.e. to get to work) so repayments are the way forward,but i do agree that people don't seem to realise the gravitas of taking out loans,without thinking about the repayments.


simon


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## SPEEDKING777 (Jul 17, 2014)

Doesn't really make a difference, buying majority of cars means your going to lose money, if your happy with that then so be it, your not buying with the intention of making profit. If you can deal with the flaws to fuel some kind of excitement in your life then its not a big deal. No point in working and not enjoying your self.


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## goRt (May 17, 2011)

Evo9lution said:


> That's a very prudent and valid comment. However, it doesn't always suit everyone; in much the same way as some people have mortgages and some people rent. The important thing is to make sure that you review your finances thoroughly and don't stretch yourself too tightly (and only ever get a loan that will be worth less than the value of the car should you sell it ...).
> 
> In reality, though this is a very controversial thing to say, there is very, very little difference between getting a loan on a house (mortgage) and getting a loan on a car. They're both objects that once the loan is paid off you will own outright; or sell for the equity if you decide to upgrade / need the cash early.
> 
> ...


That's exactly the strategy I follow, of I can't pay cash, total it and buy the same then I don't buy it.
Allowed me to retire at 50 and run my my11 without worry.


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## Firestarter (Mar 8, 2014)

Caveman said:


> I think the biggest cost to GTR ownership, which is inevitable, but does add hugely to the burden of ownership, is MODS!
> 
> The car screams out to be modified, and unless you spend no time on the internet and this forum, the temptation to mod, be it cosmetically or performance wise, is huge.
> 
> ...


Spot on:bowdown1:


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## scoooby slayer (Jun 13, 2009)

Evo9lution said:


> As I said, it's prudent not to take a loan but it's still eminently possible without being foolish. It's an option that people can utilise, that's all.
> 
> I would argue that it's less risky and has potentially infinitely better (long-term) outcome than paying rent for your home ... however, many, many people are in that situation & they're not called foolish. What about those that play the markets ...
> 
> ...



I do agree with you aswell in circumstances money might be needed that's there but tied up in other things like I explained in my post about our dozers, im looking at the perspective where there potentially isn't any tied up wealth to be spoke of and even to the point where money is borrowed to buy a car with not even enough to cover it in equity or anything else, that's really the point im making tbh that in those circumstances imo its a no no as its not realistically affordable imo


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## TREG (May 20, 2004)

Adamantium said:


> Didn't that cost you 3% of the loan by way of balance transfer?


What loan?

I paid for most of the car by switch and then put the extra £7k on my credit card which was interest free for 16 months:chuckle:


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## TREG (May 20, 2004)

Nickgtr35 said:


> My11 from new,I reckon costs including depreciation are going to cost avg £10,000 to £12,000 per year based on 8,000 miles per year




I don't think many drivers cover 8k a year though so actual costs would be far less than that imho


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## tonigmr2 (Sep 12, 2002)

I do think some people buy GTRs (even the older ones) without realising what they cost to run. If you are stretching to buy in the first place you are making a mistake IMHO - and it's very evident when you see cars with a few short term owners that they made that mistake!

Having said that, I will take finance on a car if it is affordable. The way I see it is some people waste money on holidays, drinking, or whatever. If I want to waste money on a car well that's up to me.:chuckle: (but never for more than 2/3 of the cars worth!)


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## snuffy (Mar 26, 2014)

TREG said:


> What loan?
> 
> I paid for most of the car by switch and then put the extra £7k on my credit card which was interest free for 16 months:chuckle:


Whilst the credit card debt may well be interest free, they all charge an upfront fee of around 3% or so. So the day they give you £7k, you owe £7210 (i.e. £7000 + 3%). There's no interest on the £7210, but you have paid some interest, albeit a very small amount.


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## smoggy12345 (Aug 4, 2013)

While the comments about not borrowing money are exactly right. This would be the ideal situation. But I can imagine that you are the very few fortunate people in this situation that can BUY A CAR OUTRIGHT (especially a GT-R @ 40k+!!!) and still have money to spare. I'm guessing its probably less that 1% of the population that this is applicable to. I'm 28yrs old have a big mortgage and definitely dont have the cash to buy outright. Unfortunately I have an undying passion for cars and speed and the GT-R is sitting near the top of my ambitions list. At this point, call me mad, but it would include a hefty amount of finance to own the car, but nothing outrageous. I'm paying £365p/m at the moment for the loan on my TT-RS (cue abusive comments - but be aware its APR stg1 @ 410bhp and would give your un-modded GT-Rs a fun for their money, in a straight line of course, on a track you can forget it haha ) however I only expect 400 - 450p/m for a GT-R so not obscenely different and well within my budget....its the running costs that worry me slightly. although so far on the TTRS i've spend 800 on tyres, £700 on brakes (another £300 expected soon), £200 on exhaust, £100 on sensor repair, and £700 on APR remap + due a service soon at probs £400 (total £3100) and thats in 10months so I cannot imagine the GT-R would be far infront of these costs over 10months/1yr of ownership (might even be LESS!) ....and I'm still sat financially comfortable right now ....this is what has made me look again at GT-R's as is becoming more and more probable that i can afford to run one.


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## TREG (May 20, 2004)

snuffy said:


> Whilst the credit card debt may well be interest free, they all charge an upfront fee of around 3% or so. So the day they give you £7k, you owe £7210 (i.e. £7000 + 3%). There's no interest on the £7210, but you have paid some interest, albeit a very small amount.




You may of done but the card I had was completely interest free so I borrowed £7k and paid no more than £7k back.

No interest was paid at all


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## Adamantium (Jun 24, 2002)

It's not usual to spend £1000 on TTRS brakes and £700 on a remap. On top of that fuel in the gtr is twice as bad and tax is £500 not £230.

I've been reading the above and am pleased to see some sensible responses with regard to borrowing money. I'm 36 and have never financed a car in my life feeling the way others above have commented. 

I'm now better off than I've been before yet now I don't think I'd buy a car outright again. Cash is the least efficient way to keep money, especially with the current exchange rates. With the in mind, the money coming from the sale of my car is being split into two and used as the deposit on two buy to let flats. When I choose to replace the car it makes more sense to finance them than waste the cash required as a deposit on property which (hopefully)earns me more than the lost interest payments on the car loan.


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## JapFreak786 (Aug 29, 2003)

Interesting ways of getting a 35! Work smart and it can work in your favour by the looks of things, just don't mention religion and finance lol

still want one myself, but a friend picked up his new 34 GTR over the weekend and I drove it for a good 50 miles and i realisd how much I miss my old one, he is already wanting to modify his following me showing him some threads here lol


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## smoggy12345 (Aug 4, 2013)

Your right it's not usual to Spend £1000 on brakes but I had problems with them which resulted in a lot of labour costs, new pads all round and possibly now 2 new front discs + I decided to change fluid for race spec and had stainless steel lines fitted hence the £1000 cost.....sickening I know. Should have cost £400 - £500 max without the need for new discs.

500 per year Tax is nothing new to me after owning Subaru Impreza's in the past (was £460 per yr at the time) The TTRS is £280 per yr at the moment. Also I average 24mpg in the TT....19mpg on a fast run and 32mpg(A figure I find astonishing in a car with 410bhp  absoutley LOVE the 2.5TFSI unit) on a motorway. Not head and shoulders above the GT-R really? 

The point i was making is that I had costs from the car the nearly matched that of a GT-R and I'm still comfortable financially therefore would it be reasonable to assume I could afford to run one? I would expect maybe £100 - 150 per month extra running costs for the car over what I have now.

Dean


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## smoggy12345 (Aug 4, 2013)

Another question:

What are the routes people take on replacing discs these days? I'm assuming there are much cheaper aftermarket parts these days? A while ago I was hearing £1k per corner discs and pads? This still about correct? What about tyres also, I have seen now that people are using Michellin super sports these days aswell....are they much cheaper than the bridgestone/dunlops?


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## tonigmr2 (Sep 12, 2002)

Adamantium said:


> I'm now better off than I've been before yet now I don't think I'd buy a car outright again. Cash is the least efficient way to keep money, especially with the current exchange rates. With the in mind, the money coming from the sale of my car is being split into two and used as the deposit on two buy to let flats. When I choose to replace the car it makes more sense to finance them than waste the cash required as a deposit on property which (hopefully)earns me more than the lost interest payments on the car loan.


Exactly, I actually think it a bit daft to cash fund a car. I have my Disco on a very favourable deal with LR, it's better for me to keep my capital to use elsewhere!


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## SamboGrove (Jun 27, 2010)

smoggy12345 said:


> Another question:
> 
> What are the routes people take on replacing discs these days? I'm assuming there are much cheaper aftermarket parts these days? A while ago I was hearing £1k per corner discs and pads? This still about correct? What about tyres also, I have seen now that people are using Michellin super sports these days aswell....are they much cheaper than the bridgestone/dunlops?


Alcons (380s rather than 400s) + pagid rs29s can be had for around £2200 inc vat for a full set front and rear. Obviously you've gotta add labour + fluids etc to install but still well short of £1k a corner. Cheaper pads can be had too to cut costs further like ferodos or cosworth.


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## Adamantium (Jun 24, 2002)

tonigmr2 said:


> Exactly, I actually think it a bit daft to cash fund a car. I have my Disco on a very favourable deal with LR, it's better for me to keep my capital to use elsewhere!


Apologies, I meant interest rates, not exchange rates.


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## Silver R (Apr 23, 2013)

smoggy12345 said:


> While the comments about not borrowing money are exactly right. This would be the ideal situation. But I can imagine that you are the very few fortunate people in this situation that can BUY A CAR OUTRIGHT (especially a GT-R @ 40k+!!!) and still have money to spare. I'm guessing its probably less that 1% of the population that this is applicable to. I'm 28yrs old have a big mortgage and definitely dont have the cash to buy outright. Unfortunately I have an undying passion for cars and speed and the GT-R is sitting near the top of my ambitions list. At this point, call me mad, but it would include a hefty amount of finance to own the car, but nothing outrageous. I'm paying £365p/m at the moment for the loan on my TT-RS (cue abusive comments - but be aware its APR stg1 @ 410bhp and would give your un-modded GT-Rs a fun for their money, in a straight line of course, on a track you can forget it haha ) however I only expect 400 - 450p/m for a GT-R so not obscenely different and well within my budget....its the running costs that worry me slightly. although so far on the TTRS i've spend 800 on tyres, £700 on brakes (another £300 expected soon), £200 on exhaust, £100 on sensor repair, and £700 on APR remap + due a service soon at probs £400 (total £3100) and thats in 10months so I cannot imagine the GT-R would be far infront of these costs over 10months/1yr of ownership (might even be LESS!) ....and I'm still sat financially comfortable right now ....this is what has made me look again at GT-R's as is becoming more and more probable that i can afford to run one.



Only part of that I picked up was TTRS, your hairdressers must be doing really well to step up to a gtr lol! TTRS is extremely quick just a pity the image they carry


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## FLYNN (Oct 6, 2006)

Silver R said:


> TTRS is extremely quick just a pity the image they carry


You could say the same thing about GT-Rs to be fair


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## Adamantium (Jun 24, 2002)

FLYNN said:


> You could say the same thing about GT-Rs to be fair


Completely agree. I'd rather be a hairdresser than a chav.

Sadly, if I buy a ferrari or mclaren, then I'll be branded a w4nker.

Looks like I have to revert to the only car with no image, an original mini.


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## smoggy12345 (Aug 4, 2013)

Some of the stage 1 and 2 TT-RS S-Tronics are recording 0-60 in 2.8 secs with the launch control....low 12's for the 1/4  ....so really is no slouch! Of course that is with the remap....in standard guise they're nothing out the ordinary for a performance car. Shame mine is a manual but still expect sub 4secs to 60 on stg 1 which is on par with most supercars of the last decade!


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## LEO-RS (Mar 18, 2011)

smoggy12345 said:


> Some of the stage 1 and 2 TT-RS S-Tronics are recording 0-60 in 2.8 secs with the launch control....low 12's for the 1/4  ....so really is no slouch! Of course that is with the remap....in standard guise they're nothing out the ordinary for a performance car. Shame mine is a manual but still expect sub 4secs to 60 on stg 1 which is on par with most supercars of the last decade!


Just to correct you there....

Stage 1 TTRS (410hp) - 3.2 (11.6 1/4)
Stage 2 TTRS (430hp) - 3.0 (11.3 1/4)
Stage 3 TTRS (500hp+) - 2.8 (10.8 1/4) - This was a manual transmission car though, haven't seen any Stage 3 S-Tronic 1/4m runs.

The standard car runs the 1/4m in 12.1secs (S-Tronic)

I think most of the guys here are aware of its performance, I've done enough winding up. Great cars, cheap to run, insure, tax and go like the clappers. TTRS is a little old school now on the Mk2 TT platform. Mk3 TT coming in the next few months, RS will more likely be a good 12-18mths away.

Back to the original post, I would say No, don't bother. You're aiming at 09/10 plate cars out of warranty, the 485hp engine, no proper launch control, you'll still have the associated running costs and the car is 5yrs old and now a little dated. You'll find that it probably wont be a step up in performance from your TTRS (certainly not in a straight line anyway)

Plug your money into a newer car, there's plenty having just been released, M3/M4, Cayman GTS, Audi S3 8V (Pretty much same as an RS3 8P performance wise) CLA45 AMG, then there's the upcoming RS3 8V (Hopefully a saloon variant) and then the new TTRS. S4/S5 releases imminent in next 12 months too (Cars listed premium German badged <£65k)

A 2009 GTR is not the way to go coming into 2015, its old skool, old tech and can be expensive if you buy one that's had a hard life. If you want to step into a GTR, you should really be looking at in warranty models, MY12 cars and upwards, far better than the earlier cars.

Just my input but as I'm not a GTR owner, may not be worth much. £75k is a decent salary but if you're planning kids soon and its then a single income, it may be a struggle with a decent sized mortgage. Last thing you want to be doing is blowing £1k-£1.5k of that each month running/financing an old skool GTR.


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## Adamantium (Jun 24, 2002)

I think it's dated because we are used to it.

it could come out now having never been seen before and it wouldn't be dated in terms of tech.

It doesn't have audi interior styling, but then it didn't when it came out, it was known for its japanese design origins.

You say the tech is out of date but I completely disagree. It's not a hybrid performance car but then nothing that Leo mentioned is either.

Personally, I'd agree with Leo where an 09 is concerned but if going for the sat nav car the tech is better than all but the latest audi tech which is excessively over complex and incredibly expensive to spec up - £800 for a tv tuner, £500 for dab tuner, £2000 for mmi 3g plus (not that good) etc.

Once in the nav car, the interior tech is as good if not better than all but the latest audi TT and usability is far better. The engine and gearbox tech is far from outdated. The lack of launch control is insignificant once you have an ecutek on there which brings the tech in line with the latest models.

If you are comparing the modding potential, don't go there! A modded TTRS is ok in a straight line, but it doesn't take much for a modded GTR to move the game on enormously, and the crime is that we are talking about straight lines, the GTR out of the box destroys all the above cars in the bends, that's not to take anything away from an s-tronic R8 which is a fantastic car, but is FAR more outdated than even an 09 GTR.

I don't believe you'd be disappointed with an 09 plate car, but having been someone earning 75k, with two children and a mortgage, I still wouldn't go into the debt you are talking about for a GT-R.

I'd be more inclined to get a second hand evo X SST, or stick where you are until you know what's happening on the family front.

Trouble is, to many car nuts, it's an itch that must be scratched. So long as you are prepared to lose out on selling again, or face the fear of waiting for it to sell, there's no harm in trying it and throwing in the towel soon afterwards.


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## gtr mart (Mar 29, 2004)

What's more most early cars will have updated gearbox software and launch control. I have a 2010 model. It has over 600hp. That's lots of power for the road. A newer car will also depreciate like a bomb. The 2009/2010 models are closing in on the point where plebs and chavs can start to afford them too which will open up demand from more people which should help a little with depreciation. Also having never been in a 2011+ car, I don't know what I am missing and on that basis really don't care.


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## lawsy (Feb 25, 2009)

scoooby slayer said:


> more fool them imo, as my dad always told me "you cant spend what you havnt got"
> 
> unfortunately nowadays that's exactly what everyone wants to do spend it before they've earnt it, complete and utter madness imo


So you have no mortgage?


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## smoggy12345 (Aug 4, 2013)

I Think I have just been called a pled/chav xD 

Whist I sand corrected on the TTRS Times, I have seen people on the forums with stage 2 S-Tronics claim 2.8 on the Vbox....have a look for yourself. Low 11's though for 1/4 .....thought it was low 12's lol, but even better.

Shame it understeers like a dog and the front brakes are on par with a 1.2 corsa.

As far as tech is concerned....tell me of a car that can go that fast, looks that good, has newer tech and is still <40k..... impossible! Only downside is the interior but I can live with that, had a few jap cars in the past and this will surpass all of them on the interior front.

Still undecided though....it is alot of cash...haven't got any kids yet but planning on in the next year or so. So I do have time to squeeze 1/2yr ownership in before sensible head apears but like some1 mentioned if I cant sell it i'd be lumped with the costs with less income.


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## jambo 32gtr (Apr 1, 2009)

Adamantium said:


> Completely agree. I'd rather be a hairdresser than a chav.
> 
> Sadly, if I buy a ferrari or mclaren, then I'll be branded a w4nker.
> 
> Looks like I have to revert to the only car with no image, an original mini.


Are you really that bothered what people think about you ??


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## Adamantium (Jun 24, 2002)

lawsy said:


> So you have no mortgage?


It's a bit different borrowing to buy something that goes up in value faster than inflation.


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## AdnanK (Jun 11, 2013)

smoggy12345 said:


> As far as tech is concerned....tell me of a car that can go that fast, looks that good, has newer tech and is still <40k..... impossible!


Looks? Quite girly looking and minimal road presence. No one gives them a second look 

Fast? Yes, they certainly are.


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## stixGTR (Sep 24, 2013)

smoggy12345 said:


> Just a question, if it's not too intrusive?
> 
> I'm in a similiar situation to the OP and just wondered what sort of wage you guys earn and what sort of outgoings you have and still manage to own & run a GT-R?
> 
> ...


I dont mind answering your question. I'm a serviceman on 30k a year total household income of just shy of 50k 

I run the car as a daily and get by. There is a lot of opinions on here about money and whether or not things are affordable. 

Life is short... you get one chance..... do the things you want to do or you'll regret it later.
I was nearly killed 4 years ago...... now I live my life one day at a time...

I swear by this statement "never regret what you've done, regret what you haven't - live before you die, don't die before you've lived" 

If you want a GTR, then get one..... thats the only way you'll know if you can afford one...... people have babies..... nobody can afford them either.

No point being the richest man in the graveyard eh


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## scoooby slayer (Jun 13, 2009)

lawsy said:


> So you have no mortgage?



if you quoted the whole message I wrote it would of also said "put the money into property, not a car"

its all to easy to sign on the never never and end up in a world of debt very easily, work, save, buy simples 


and as you asked my own home and business has no mortgages/finance, my rental property has 21% mortgage left on interest only at the moment and the rental income covers the mortgage payments 5 fold 

so yes I have a little mortgage but the mortgage is about 3% of the total equity I have in property and land so not really an issue lol

i like to be able to afford anything i buy a few times over in cash, equity or investment before i buy it or i go without.


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## simon tompkins (Aug 14, 2005)

yes but you can only make that statement because you are fortunate enough to have (by the sounds of it)that sort of money in the first place.not everyone has the busines acumen you obviously have,otherwise we would all drive Porsches and gtr's,some of us are just normal bods with normal everyday jobs,with an average income its very easy to sit on a soapbox quoting what you would and wouldn't do with your money when you've got it to begin with,(and I'm not saying you haven't earned or worked hard for it)I'm merely trying to bring some reality to this topic.

simon


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## stixGTR (Sep 24, 2013)

simon tompkins said:


> yes but you can only make that statement because you are fortunate enough to have (by the sounds of it)that sort of money in the first place.not everyone has the busines acumen you obviously have,otherwise we would all drive Porsches and gtr's,some of us are just normal bods with normal everyday jobs,with an average income its very easy to sit on a soapbox quoting what you would and wouldn't do with your money when you've got it to begin with,(and I'm not saying you haven't earned or worked hard for it)I'm merely trying to bring some reality to this topic.
> 
> simon


+1:bowdown1:


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## scoooby slayer (Jun 13, 2009)

simon tompkins said:


> yes but you can only make that statement because you are fortunate enough to have (by the sounds of it)that sort of money in the first place.not everyone has the busines acumen you obviously have,otherwise we would all drive Porsches and gtr's,some of us are just normal bods with normal everyday jobs,with an average income its very easy to sit on a soapbox quoting what you would and wouldn't do with your money when you've got it to begin with,(and I'm not saying you haven't earned or worked hard for it)I'm merely trying to bring some reality to this topic.
> 
> simon



its not that long ago it was a stretch for me to buy an £8k saph cosworth, I was earning £1200 a month with a £600 a month mortgage on my first home ! it was overtime and selling turbos I made a little extra from and I lived within my means and bought the cosworth once I had saved enough to buy it, just because my pot is now bigger I still apply the exact same ethic money will never change me into some rich [email protected] I promise you that  


going back to when I had my first home with a mortgage on a lowly wage £8 an hour at the time, there is no way on this earth would I of spent £50k on a car, it would of been madness as realistically I couldn't afford it I didn't even have £50k worth of equity at the time !
just buy a car you can easily afford and be happy with it, or work harder and make more money and save it, I have been working 7 days a week now for about 3 months doing from 70 - 100 hrs a week every week ! I work about as hard as is humanly possible 


I had an r32 gtr, an r33 gtr and a c210 skyline which had cost me £26000 total, I sold and broke them for parts and made £40k return, that was most of my gtr fund sorted just a lot of hard work to earn that money


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## FLYNN (Oct 6, 2006)

scoooby slayer said:


> its not that long ago it was a stretch for me to buy an £8k saph cosworth, I was earning £1200 a month with a £600 a month mortgage on my first home ! it was overtime and selling turbos I made a little extra from and I lived within my means and bought the cosworth once I had saved enough to buy it, just because my pot is now bigger I still apply the exact same ethic money will never change me into some rich [email protected] I promise you that
> 
> 
> going back to when I had my first home with a mortgage on a lowly wage £8 an hour at the time, there is no way on this earth would I of spent £50k on a car, it would of been madness as realistically I couldn't afford it I didn't even have £50k worth of equity at the time !


I wish you'd put your old balls away. Im sick of looking at them


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## snuffy (Mar 26, 2014)

simon tompkins said:


> yes but you can only make that statement because you are fortunate enough to have (by the sounds of it)that sort of money in the first place.not everyone has the busines acumen you obviously have,otherwise we would all drive Porsches and gtr's,some of us are just normal bods with normal everyday jobs,with an average income its very easy to sit on a soapbox quoting what you would and wouldn't do with your money when you've got it to begin with,(and I'm not saying you haven't earned or worked hard for it)I'm merely trying to bring some reality to this topic.
> 
> simon


+2 :bowdown1:

A friend of mine once said to me he did not understand why people have a mortgage. Why don't people just buy a house for cash ? Because he's in that position he fails to grasp that the vast majority of people are not in the same position as he is.


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## scoooby slayer (Jun 13, 2009)

FLYNN said:


> I wish you'd put your old balls away. Im sick of looking at them


go cut some hair, your a troll Flynn plain and simple, grow up.


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## JohnE90M3 (May 31, 2010)

snuffy said:


> +2 :bowdown1:
> 
> A friend of mine once said to me he did not understand why people have a mortgage. Why don't people just buy a house for cash ? Because he's in that position he fails to grasp that the vast majority of people are not in the same position as he is.


I am also in a "Fortunate Position" and can now buy what I want cash.
*But* in the past it was a secondhand dustbin, slowly moving up.
I understand the "we have not got it" brigade *my philosophy * has always been "if you can't by it outright" leave it till you can car wise. 
It's a loss maker after all.
My LCI M5 losses £850/month before it moves off the drive.


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## FLYNN (Oct 6, 2006)

scoooby slayer said:


> go cut some hair, *your *a troll Flynn plain and simple, grow up.


*You're


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## lawsy (Feb 25, 2009)

Adamantium said:


> It's a bit different borrowing to buy something that goes up in value faster than inflation.


No it's not, because a 25 yr mortgage, payments inline with inflation with interest on means that many are not profitable especially given the upkeep if them. 

The guy made a statement about people borrowing to buy cars, stating that he was taught by his dad only to have something if you can afford cash. Yet he likely has/had a mortgage.

People also forget the leg up in life their parents gave them, and without a silver spoon would never be in the position they are now in. 

Not aimed at scooby slayer btw.


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## lawsy (Feb 25, 2009)

scoooby slayer said:


> its not that long ago it was a stretch for me to buy an £8k saph cosworth, I was earning £1200 a month with a £600 a month mortgage on my first home ! it was overtime and selling turbos I made a little extra from and I lived within my means and bought the cosworth once I had saved enough to buy it, just because my pot is now bigger I still apply the exact same ethic money will never change me into some rich [email protected] I promise you that
> 
> 
> going back to when I had my first home with a mortgage on a lowly wage £8 an hour at the time, there is no way on this earth would I of spent £50k on a car, it would of been madness as realistically I couldn't afford it I didn't even have £50k worth of equity at the time !


So a mortgage of 50% of your income and you are condoning people borrowing far less % of their disposable income whilst enjoying life. 

If you finance a car sensibly, what's the worst that can happen? Give it back.


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## stixGTR (Sep 24, 2013)

Amazing how people are quick to shout "save!! Buy cash !! If you can't afford it dont have it" 

I have 3 questions. 

How many of you people saying this started with [email protected] all and genuinely worked hard abd all hours for what you have ? 

How many are 'self employed' tax dodging toss pots who earn 7k on paper but pay themselves dividends that far exceed the average wage. ?

How many are just money launderers ?


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## lawsy (Feb 25, 2009)

stixGTR said:


> Amazing how people are quick to shout "save!! Buy cash !! If you can't afford it dont have it"
> 
> I have 3 questions.
> 
> ...


I blow men off. I have knee pads and a spit cup.

Times are hard ATM, competition is fierce, as Flynn has taken most of my customers, apparently he's better at it than me. That's we he can afford Nicky Clarkes old Audi


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## FLYNN (Oct 6, 2006)

lawsy said:


> I blow men off. I have knee pads and a spit cup.
> 
> Times are hard ATM, competition is fierce, as Flynn has taken most of my customers, apparently he's better at it than me. That's we he can afford Nicky Clarkes old Audi


You wasn't willing to stick a digit up the old 'arris. That's why they come to me now.


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## lawsy (Feb 25, 2009)

FLYNN said:


> You wasn't willing to stick a digit up the old 'arris. That's why they come to me now.


Naive to give away your secrets. A Portuguese boat lands tonight. Lock jaw here I come. :flame:


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## goRt (May 17, 2011)

stixGTR said:


> Amazing how people are quick to shout "save!! Buy cash !! If you can't afford it dont have it"
> 
> I have 3 questions.
> 
> How many of you people saying this started with [email protected] all and genuinely worked hard abd all hours for what you have


Me, comprehensive school in Birmingham, retired at 50, paid cash for both of my GT-Rs.

Salary man all of my working life, so paid my 50% under labour.

Thanks for asking.


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## smoggy12345 (Aug 4, 2013)

AdnanK said:


> Looks? Quite girly looking and minimal road presence. No one gives them a second look
> 
> Fast? Yes, they certainly are.


I was on about the GT-R ?? I think you're on about the TT-RS? I think the GT-R isn't feminine looking at all!


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## TREG (May 20, 2004)

stixGTR said:


> Life is short... you get one chance..... do the things you want to do or you'll regret it later.
> I was nearly killed 4 years ago...... now I live my life one day at a time...




Vin is it you? Living life a quarter mile at a time?!

Same reason I bought mine, lost a mate in a accident and thought sod it I'm having a 35!!


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## stixGTR (Sep 24, 2013)

goRt said:


> Me, comprehensive school in Birmingham, retired at 50, paid cash for both of my GT-Rs.
> 
> Salary man all of my working life, so paid my 50% under labour.
> 
> Thanks for asking.


Respect to you.


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## SPEEDKING777 (Jul 17, 2014)

The question really is... can YOU afford it?


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## stixGTR (Sep 24, 2013)

TREG said:


> Vin is it you? Living life a quarter mile at a time?!
> 
> Same reason I bought mine, lost a mate in a accident and thought sod it I'm having a 35!!


Only get one bite of the cherry..... never know when your time is up


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## simon tompkins (Aug 14, 2005)

its a good thread with a bit of banter and you can't beat that,no i can't afford one but i would absolutely love one.and the silly thing is i could have bought one with the money I've spent on my gtt (£34,000) and still spending.

simon


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## Hazza (Jun 2, 2011)

How's paying yourself dividends tax dodging when you have to pay corporation tax before you take them?


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## snuffy (Mar 26, 2014)

Hazza said:


> How's paying yourself dividends tax dodging when you have to pay corporation tax before you take them?


Correct. 

And if your dividend income exceeds the 40% threshold then you pay the additional income tax as well. But the media has made a big song and dance about this and so the majority of people think (wrongly) that if you pay yourself dividends then somehow you don't pay tax. Of course you do, as you say, your company pays corporation tax and then you the the delta income tax as well.


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## FLYNN (Oct 6, 2006)

snuffy said:


> Correct.
> 
> And if your dividend income exceeds the 40% threshold then you pay the additional income tax as well. But the media has made a big song and dance about this and so the majority of people think (wrongly) that if you pay yourself dividends then somehow you don't pay tax. Of course you do, as you say, your company pays corporation tax and then you the the delta income tax as well.


...........If youre a limited company of course


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## snuffy (Mar 26, 2014)

FLYNN said:


> ...........If youre a limited company of course


Well, yes. But if you pay dividends then you'd be a limited company.


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## TAZZMAXX (Mar 9, 2010)

But you don't always pay corporation tax.


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## Hazza (Jun 2, 2011)

Only if you're a tax dodger like you  or do a lot of R&D or make no profit.


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## TAZZMAXX (Mar 9, 2010)

No crime in any of those but a bitch if you want to try and get personal finance.


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## Hazza (Jun 2, 2011)

A bitch even if you do make profits and pay tax but haven't for more than a couple of years. Although I think self certification had run its course.


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## scoooby slayer (Jun 13, 2009)

stixGTR said:


> Amazing how people are quick to shout "save!! Buy cash !! If you can't afford it dont have it"
> 
> I have 3 questions.
> 
> ...


to give you some idea, I have been working 7 days for 3 months straight now, from 70 - 100 hrs every week ! i can sleep at night knowing 100% i have earnt every penny i have


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## gtr mart (Mar 29, 2004)

scoooby slayer said:


> to give you some idea, I have been working 7 days for 3 months straight now, from 70 - 100 hrs every week ! i can sleep at night knowing 100% i have earnt every penny i have


Most of which is spent posting on the GT-R register.. :chuckle:


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## scoooby slayer (Jun 13, 2009)

gtr mart said:


> Most of which is spent posting on the GT-R register.. :chuckle:


lol im currently doing this




700lbft of torque at 2000 rpm that beast will pull all day at that no sweat



in the office now making a start on 16 employees wages before I got back out into the next field


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## Adamantium (Jun 24, 2002)

I tried to get a mortgage last month based on 98% ownership of a limited company.

The company had made enough profit to clear a substantial debt but because the debt was paid not dividends they didn't deem that I'd earned the income and so wouldn't lend to me on that basis.

It's an absolute joke, all they wanted to know was what I personally had paid on my tax return, it made no difference if I earned valuable companies that were making decent profit, I had to actually remove the money from the companies for them to consider it earned.


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## tonigmr2 (Sep 12, 2002)

Banks are obsessed with income ATM, I've known a couple of people that, despite owning large properties outright, have been refused fairly small scale loans of £25-30k because income could not be demonstrated (both have profitable companies). Seems to be the way of things.


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## Adamantium (Jun 24, 2002)

They did suggest it was very much about income vs. outgoings rather than annual income/profits.

They went through my bank statements to determine all the regular payments and work out what my disposable income was each month. It was odd that they were not concerned company successes. To be fair, they did apologise for it and blamed new regulations on lending brought in in April.


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## TylernicisGTR (Jun 12, 2014)

Wish i could afford one


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## ROG350Z (Jun 15, 2008)

Interesting thread. As Adamantium said (and I think we are agreeing) that why tie capital up in a car when borrowing the money is 'cheap' at the moment with interest rates which will probably never be lower in our lifetime. You can fix your car payments at a level you can afford for three to five years. Trick, for peace of mind, is to put in enough cash to mean you can sell without negative equity worst case.

You can then use your capital, which you would have 'invested' in the car (depreciating asset and, in effect only saving you 3-5% per annum depending on your borrowing capability) to work for you. I did that and funded half the car at 2.25% flat for the remainder over three years which freed up capital I could have used to put deposit down on my London flat. 

It is interesting those who say only buy what you can pay for - and I empathise with that ethos but it is not necessarily always correct for everyone. By employing the ethos I have stated it is possible, with luck and a degree of judgement, to make more than the cost of your car in returns by borrowing money. Even £10-20k deposit buying a property for buy to let (obviously in north east as that wouldn't get somewhere in south) could return return on investment ANd pay for the interest you are incurring on the monies borrowed for the car.

Horses for courses and depends on your appetite for risk of course. But neither method is right, or wrong just different.


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## ROG350Z (Jun 15, 2008)

smoggy12345 said:


> Another question:
> 
> What are the routes people take on replacing discs these days? I'm assuming there are much cheaper aftermarket parts these days? A while ago I was hearing £1k per corner discs and pads? This still about correct? What about tyres also, I have seen now that people are using Michellin super sports these days aswell....are they much cheaper than the bridgestone/dunlops?


I don't want to think about brake disk replacement costs.....;-(


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## GTS20s (Oct 7, 2008)

Is it just me or are white 2009 GTR's like hens teeth??


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## CT17 (Mar 25, 2011)

GTS20s said:


> Is it just me or are white 2009 GTR's like hens teeth??


It's you.


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## GTS20s (Oct 7, 2008)

CT17 said:


> It's you.


Haha I must be looking in the wrong places


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