# GTR "v" Focus RS



## Wildrover (Dec 16, 2008)

Autocar are pitting the RS against the GT-R in next weeks magazine. Which do you think will be their favourite?

My guess the RS!


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## jamesbilluk (Aug 10, 2006)

I would go with them liking the RS aswell


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## Trev (Nov 1, 2003)

PMSL!

I'd love to see the RS time round the "Ring"......lol.


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## ANDYR35 (Sep 1, 2008)

Bit of a stupid pairing to be comparing.

I reckon they will pick the RS too, just because it is British yadda yadda revo knuckle blah blah


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## Howsie (Feb 25, 2002)

It isn't British.


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## doggiehowser (Oct 8, 2007)

I wonder how long the tyres would last on the RS. Didn't Fifth Gear do a spirited drive uphill with the RS? I think they were trying to show the really good bits on the RS, but the amount of tyre wear on the FF drivetrain was just not pretty.

Too bad Ford didn't really make the RS to be 4WD from the start.


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## sumo69 (Mar 31, 2008)

They couldn't suffer the weight penalty of adding 4wd - the car weights about 1500kg already and 4wd would add 200kg to that.

The engine power would need to be 350bhp to make up for that which is beyond the reliability threshold of the engine and more importantly the gearbox (which means torque in 1st and 2nd gears is already limited in 300bhp form).

D


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## stealth (Jul 6, 2004)

Total dumb test ,whats the point ? They are not in the same class ,so how can you compare ? It's not like someone is thinking of wether to go for a GTR or a focus.


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## doggiehowser (Oct 8, 2007)

And people complain the GTR is heavy 

3.8TT with complex AWD, 20" rims and rubber, huge brakes, user adjustable suspension on-the-fly and DSG for < 1.8tonnes with a fair amount of creature comforts.


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## EvolutionVI (Sep 6, 2005)

The Ford Locus has a bigger boot

+ it can be driven with ESP off without loosing the warranty:chuckle:


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## ANDYR35 (Sep 1, 2008)

Howsie said:


> It isn't British.



Neither is the new Mini but everyone still crows about it's "Britishness"

Going to be the same in this instance too!!


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## Howsie (Feb 25, 2002)

ANDYR35 said:


> Neither is the new Mini but everyone still crows about it's "Britishness"
> 
> Going to be the same in this instance too!!


Do they? I hadn't noticed. Mini used to be a British company, unlike Ford. You're mistake


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## Jacey Boy (Apr 24, 2005)

Depends how they test them, but im also going with the RS as im sure it will feel much more "nimble"


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## FlowersGTR (Mar 30, 2008)

Howsie said:


> Do they? I hadn't noticed. Mini used to be a British company, unlike Ford. You're mistake


people do talk about it a bit
the mini although made in britain was designed by BMW in germany
the ford focus although an american company i think its designed (dont know about built) in britain
depends on your point of view


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## Howsie (Feb 25, 2002)

Again, I hadn't noticed.

Mini used to be a British company. It was a British car then. 

Everyone I've ever spoken to knows its not anymore.


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## BigNige (Jun 1, 2008)

Are they really comparing these two cars?!
Agree with the above post, why would someone after a gtr decide 'no I'll think I'll take the focus'...


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## Howsie (Feb 25, 2002)

I agree it doesn't make sense but I'll be keen to read what they have to say. Surly thats the point.


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## Inca (Mar 28, 2002)

well there's a new hot hatch and it's supposed to be pretty good, so they pit it against the GTR which is the new benchmark. Where the RS has moved the game on in it's class, so has the GTR, (well technically I'd say the GTR has made it's own class  )


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## Cris (Sep 17, 2007)

Howsie said:


> Again, I hadn't noticed.
> 
> Mini used to be a British company. It was a British car then.
> 
> Everyone I've ever spoken to knows its not anymore.


Sorry to be a pedant but Mini was never a British company. It was made by a British company. It was the Germans (via BMW) who decided that the model (Mini) should become the marque (MINI).

None the less as interesting as the Focus is it is an odd car to compare to the GTR. I guess that as the magazines seem to have decided that the RS is better than the Evo and STI the GTR is the next in line.


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## Scrappy (Sep 22, 2003)

wasnt the best time round the ring 8:16 for the RS or something like that, and that was after some serious trying and practice. Shouldnt even be compared to the GTR IMO.


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## sumo69 (Mar 31, 2008)

Scrappy said:


> wasnt the best time round the ring 8:16 for the RS or something like that, and that was after some serious trying and practice. Shouldnt even be compared to the GTR IMO.


The Megane R26.R (the stripped out version) still holds the fwd lap record @ 8.15 - I think we all know that the Ford boys would be shouting from the rooftops if they had bettered it!

Interestingly the Megane is some 250kgs lighter but only has 227bhp - the weight and lack of standard R888's is the problem.

D


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## Howsie (Feb 25, 2002)

Cris said:


> Sorry to be a pedant but Mini was never a British company. It was made by a British company. It was the Germans (via BMW) who decided that the model (Mini) should become the marque (MINI).
> 
> None the less as interesting as the Focus is it is an odd car to compare to the GTR. I guess that as the magazines seem to have decided that the RS is better than the Evo and STI the GTR is the next in line.


The Mini was made by a British company (BMC) it is now being made by a German company. That was the original point.


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## David.Yu (Jun 28, 2001)

This story is only happening because Autocar (along with a few other mags) have been given a GT-R to play with for a few days.

I think it will be an interesting comparison, but can't see them giving the RS the nod over the GT-R.


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## R33_GTS-t (Apr 27, 2005)

For some reason, I thought of this:

R26.R vs GT3RS at the 'ring:
YouTube - Nurburgring hire car: Battle Royale (R26.R Megane vs GT3RS)


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## sumo69 (Mar 31, 2008)

My copy of autocar arrived this morning - turning straight to page 40 for the review found that they were comparing the cars on the Yorkshire dales, meaning the GTR couldn't be driven all out. The summary follows:

"...on roads that suit the Focus, it will sit all day on the tail of a GTR. On roads that suit the Nissan, it would eliminate the Ford were it not for the necessary restraints imposed by driving on public roads.
The rather more interesting and unexpected discovery is that regardless of enviroment, every time we stopped it was the Ford keys that wre eyed more hungrily. When one car is such joyously good fun to drive, the fact that it may not have the grip or power of another becomes an irrelevance. To me fast is and only ever has been a route to fun, not an end in itself.
...I will state now that were we at the Ring rather than North Yorkshire, it would be the focus left in the paddock. None of the Ford's outstanding achievements on these pages dtract from what we already know about the incredible GTR. But the simple truth is that out there in the real world, not only can you use more of the Focus's performance more of the time but you will have more fun doing it."

Some stats from the test track:

0 - 60: GTR 3.8 RS 5.7
0 - 100 Focus 13.9 GTR not given but was 130mph after the same time!!

Braking from 70 - 0: Focus 47.0m GTR 40.9m (with that weight disadvantage!)

Discuss

David


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## stealth (Jul 6, 2004)

Huh ! If thats the case of comparing cars and one of em cant be driven to the max ,they might as well of compared the Veron to the Focus as well, it could sit at the back of that all day too .What a complete pointless dumb test.


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## sumo69 (Mar 31, 2008)

I assume you mean the Veyron!! I agree 100% with your conclusion.

D


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## mdr (Aug 19, 2008)

While I still have my GTR on order for October and remain hugely excited about the car, there is a good point made by this article. Is it more fun to drive a car of lesser ability hard rather than a supercar in which you cannot get near to it's limits while remaining safe and keeping your licence?

I recently sold my 911 turbo and bought a 500 abarth for a bit of fun to plug the gap until the GTR arrives, and while I'm sure it's not in the same class as the Focus RS, there is definitely something to be said for thrashing a little car around. It's made enough of an impression that I'm thinking about keeping it when the GTR arrives put it that way.


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## ANDYR35 (Sep 1, 2008)

No big shock in the outcome of that pointless article.

At the end of the day i would still prefer to waft along in my GTR knowing that i still have plenty left under my right foot while Mr Focus RS chav is ragging the tits off his motor just to keep up!!

What is next months comparison test.......Aero SSC vs Toyota Yaris???


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## michaelsk (Jul 18, 2007)

Have to agree, all a little pointless really

video now up:

Autocar Videos - Autocar.co.uk


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## ANDYR35 (Sep 1, 2008)

michaelsk said:


> Have to agree, all a little pointless really
> 
> video now up:
> 
> Autocar Videos - Autocar.co.uk




Is it just me or is that guy in the video a bit of a scruffy pleb that you just want to punch in the face!!!:chairshot

Also being a motoring journalists i would have thought they could have got their facts correct about the "Skyline" name!!


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## TheDefiantOne (Jan 30, 2008)

ANDYR35 said:


> Is it just me or is that guy in the video a bit of a scruffy pleb that you just want to punch in the face!!!:chairshot
> 
> Also being a motoring journalists i would have thought they could have got their facts correct about the "Skyline" name!!


Exactly! The first "journalist's" presentation style reminded me of the character on "That Mitchel and Web Look". The one who can't control his hands when he presents 

I've got more charisma in my little toe on my left foot than those guys combined :chuckle:


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## stealth (Jul 6, 2004)

It's a bit like going out on a date with two women, one stunning and one kind of ok ,and only shagging one of them . How could you compare the experiance if you were asked what both dates were like ?


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## Zed Ed (Oct 24, 2007)

Actually i quite like the RS and it certainly featured on my 'could I spend half what I am coughing up on the GTR and have lots of fun' car list.

Ok its in a different space market wise, but it is a top car

Presenter didn't mention key area where it kicks GTR, that is exhaust note


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## ANDYR35 (Sep 1, 2008)

Zed Ed said:


> Presenter didn't mention key area where it kicks GTR, that is exhaust note




Get the y-pipe done and you will change your views


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## Zed Ed (Oct 24, 2007)

ANDYR35 said:


> Get the y-pipe done and you will change your views


pressure to mod is building; just ordered my Zele light kit:smokin:


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## ANDYR35 (Sep 1, 2008)

Zed Ed said:


> pressure to mod is building; just ordered my Zele light kit:smokin:



nice one!!

am still debating whether or not to order too.........where you order from?


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## charles charlie (May 3, 2008)

Personally I find it satisfying that they are comparing the RS to the new benchmark, the GTR.

It wasnt that long ago that they may well have used a 911 as a comparison.

Another point to the GTR me thinks.....


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## kevinsmart (Mar 31, 2008)

Autocar will have a full GT-R road test next week: "The UK cars are here, and we've tested one to within an inch of its life".


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## sumo69 (Mar 31, 2008)

A few stats in the comparison this week:

0-60: 3.8
0-130: 13.9 (same as RS hits 100)

Braking 70-0: 40.9m (RS took 47.0m!!!)

D


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## Steve (Sep 21, 2001)

and the ******* muppets still call the best car in the world a Skyline !!!


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## ZXTTdriver (Jul 26, 2003)

Ah bless - their readers obviously all aspire to owning an RS when they grow up cos a GTR is beyond their wildest dreams (try getting an insurance quote on one when you're still only 15!) and now we're going to have loads of teenage RS drivers wanting to show us what they've got every time they see one of our GTRs. 
Poor loves, they're going to be so upset when they get off their winding country lane in north yorkshire and meet one of us on the streets!


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## sumo69 (Mar 31, 2008)

Oii - I am a subscriber and I have had 3 RS Ford's (and still have a Cosworth for trackdays).

I think you are getting confused with Max Power!

D


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## Howsie (Feb 25, 2002)

Well said! The RS is a great car.


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## Sock (Dec 16, 2007)

ZXTTdriver said:


> Ah bless - their readers obviously all aspire to owning an RS when they grow up cos a GTR is beyond their wildest dreams (try getting an insurance quote on one when you're still only 15!) and now we're going to have loads of teenage RS drivers wanting to show us what they've got every time they see one of our GTRs.
> Poor loves, they're going to be so upset when they get off their winding country lane in north yorkshire and meet one of us on the streets!


Oh dear .... you've just made this forum seem so like the Porsche forums.


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## r32SINGH (Jul 29, 2008)

both are different cars with different price,looks,layout,feel etc one it good one thing and the other is good at other things there both good cars


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## Zed Ed (Oct 24, 2007)

I've just watched the vid again and isn't this surely just the age old argument about how much performance you can actually use effectively on the road, point to point.

I can't imagine tight uphill hairpins are the GTR's strong point either:chuckle:, if my performance in underground car parks is anything to go by.

I suspect the GTR also feels a bit wide on those kind of roads shown in the vid, so a smaller car probably builds confidence, as they say


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## RSVFOUR (May 1, 2006)

mdr said:


> Is it more fun to drive a car of lesser ability hard rather than a supercar in which you cannot get near to it's limits while remaining safe and keeping your licence?
> .


IMO No  ............ because theres always track days.

I read the article today
The Ford is a phenomenal car and even more so if you dont have £50K+ to spend. Saying the RS is good doesnt make the GTR bad.

I agree its a compliment that the GTR was the supercar they chose to use to test against the Ford . This in itself is further proof that people see it above the 911 which to me is the real important point.

I was always sure the article would be stacked in favour of the RS in terms of condititons but I dont mind that and they were very clear what would happen on open roads. 

Their conclusion in favour of the RS neither surprises or worries me . The ford is great value for money and was always going to be.

But the bid difference is that however positive they were about the RS ( and they were very) they were clear that it isnt as good as a car costing double the money......

Wheras the GTR most certainly is.


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## richdevil (Dec 16, 2008)

Haven't they just made the Focus RS front wheel drive to keep those happy who spend their time burning out in ASDA car parks??

Do just mechanics buy Cosworths and RS's?
or
Do they just turn their owners into mechanics?

F ix
O r
R epair
D aily


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## Howsie (Feb 25, 2002)

Oh dear. What's happening to this place.


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## richdevil (Dec 16, 2008)

:chuckle: Have we all lost our sense of humor??:smokin:


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## Howsie (Feb 25, 2002)

Not at all. It's like hearing that old knock knock joke (again).


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## sumo69 (Mar 31, 2008)

Howsie said:


> Not at all. It's like hearing that old knock knock joke (again).


Glad i'm not the only one!

D


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## RamRod (Apr 28, 2004)

I'd be less worried about parking a focus down at asda than any GTR..


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## mdr (Aug 19, 2008)

And that's important to some people after reading the threads earlier in the week from people who are concerned about their frozen food defrosting due to heat in the boot!


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## Steve (Sep 21, 2001)

Neither of my GTR's do ASDA, TESCO, WAITROSE, SAINSBURY'S, LIDDAL, MORRISON’S or any shopping trip !! The cars are for the open road and TRACK !!!!

Right Mr DROF bring a Focus RS to CC and put your money where your big fat mouth is !!! (only joking)


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## Wildrover (Dec 16, 2008)

I would happily have both cars. The RS as the everyday car and the GT-R as the "spoil yourself" car.

Wife currently drives as ASBO ST, and its a great car (modded to 300bhp by Graham Goode), but its not an RS, I imagine the RS will be fantastic. 

However, having not had the chance to get my hands on a GT-R yet, I imagine it will be on another planet.

Horses for courses and to be honest - both very desirable.


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## stealth (Jul 6, 2004)

mdr said:


> And that's important to some people after reading the threads earlier in the week from people who are concerned about their frozen food defrosting due to heat in the boot!




Those people should definatly buy a Caravan ,not a GTR .


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## WoREoD (Apr 27, 2008)

stealth said:


> Those people should definatly buy a Caravan ,not a GTR .


I wasn't concerned about my frozen food defrosting - just about keeping my champagne cool for the picnic - cheers!


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## R33_GTS-t (Apr 27, 2005)

The conclusion seemed to be that there's a limited amount of risk you can take on a public road when it's not closed off.


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## doggiehowser (Oct 8, 2007)

stealth said:


> Those people should definatly buy a Caravan ,not a GTR .


Just get a freer flow exhaust. The stock one looks like a radiator 

And you get the go (from the freer exhaust) and the cool (no more radiator)


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## kevinsmart (Mar 31, 2008)

kevinsmart said:


> Autocar will have a full GT-R road test next week: "The UK cars are here, and we've tested one to within an inch of its life".


Magazine is now in the shops. Excellent review, particularly performance in the dry, but surprisingly poor time around the wet test track due to relatively aggressive rubber and chassis stiffness- ~5 secs slower than the reference time posted for the Mondeo shown in the previous week's issue. R8 around 1 sec quicker than the Mondeo.


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## maxxwaxx (Feb 25, 2008)

WHAT? 5 secs slower in the wet than a mondeo, surely this cant be true even with the wrong rubber on


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## Trev (Nov 1, 2003)

Autocar are full of crap.

Seriously, EVO mag p***** on it from a great height!

I honestly think they write rubbish just to get a reaction and help sales.....like the RS VS GTR write up.


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## axolotl (May 29, 2008)

autocar were better when they had harris on board i think but they are still interesting for things like in gear times which others don't seem to do in such detail and they still have some respectable experienced hacks like sutcliffe for example and andrew frankel and probably some others that i don't know about  but i must admit evo is the DBs especially with people like John Barker around. Of course now we also have great online car mags like driver's republic and autojournals both of which feature people from evo (David Yu writes for autojournals and i think richard meaden writes for driver's republic)


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## kevinsmart (Mar 31, 2008)

maxxwaxx said:


> WHAT? 5 secs slower in the wet than a mondeo, surely this cant be true even with the wrong rubber on


Yes, in fact the Fiat 500 1.4 and Hyundai I30 have posted better wet times:

How fast is your car around Autocar's test tracks? - Testerâ€™s notes

However it is put in context when you see that the Lamborghini LP640 and 911 GT3 have posted even slower times. I've driven the MIRA wet handling circuit in an Elise and it is very wet- tyre types will make a big difference.


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## Rich001 (Jul 13, 2008)

I went on a driving day today, had a drive in single seater and a GTR but on the familiarisation laps in a focus ST i commented to the instructor on it been a nice drive having never driven one before. As the company also had a new RS he said that the ST's are a good car but he didn't think the RS was that much better, unquestionably faster but his opinion was too glowing.

He obviously knew his onions though as he liked the GTR:thumbsup:

My opinion the RS is just about on top of the hatches and the one to have for road use. I'd rather have a GTR than 2 x RS's though.


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## MichaelJP59 (Jan 9, 2008)

kevinsmart said:


> Yes, in fact the Fiat 500 1.4 and Hyundai I30 have posted better wet times:
> 
> How fast is your car around Autocar's test tracks? - Tester’s notes
> 
> However it is put in context when you see that the Lamborghini LP640 and 911 GT3 have posted even slower times. I've driven the MIRA wet handling circuit in an Elise and it is very wet- tyre types will make a big difference.


Anyone who's taken delivery care to comment on wet performance on UK roads? I'd be tempted to look at better all-round tyres if those times represent the real difference in the wet.

This is a big factor to me - most of the best driving roads in the UK are in high rainfall areas.


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## Wildrover (Dec 16, 2008)

Tend to agree with Autocar after owning an ST and now the GT-R.

In the real world the RS is probably an easier car to drive in all circumstances.

In short the RS is the best daily driver.

But as a GT car - the GTR has no equal.


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